Conscious Success Co (00:01.533)
Hello Stevie, it so, so fun to have you here on the Conscious Success podcast. Thank you so much for joining us.
Stevie Case (00:08.898)
Thank you for having me. This is so exciting.
Conscious Success Co (00:11.587)
Yes. So for everyone listening, you are my former boss at one point in time and a dear friend and just such a mentor to me personally. I think you are such an embodied example of what exceptional leadership looks like and being both a smart and a kind person. And when I thought about who are people in corporate spaces who are doing it,
you know, successfully, not only in terms of that external success, but in terms of how you make people feel and bring people along like you are, you know, first person to come to mind. So thank you for being here.
Stevie Case (00:47.766)
Thank you. That means a ton. that what you described is what I aspire to. So I know I don't get there every day, but it really means a lot to hear that. And I try to do it differently. So I'm glad that's showing up at least some of the time. we had so much fun working together. So talk more about
Conscious Success Co (01:04.174)
Yeah, we did. Yeah, and I want to dive into what you do differently, and a lot of it is intentional, if imperfect as we all are. But, you know, before we even get there, you've had one of the most interesting and varied careers, like when we zoom out and look at all of the different chapters. And I remember when I found out you were the world's first, if not one of the world's first female professional video game players and your name was Kil Creek, right?
Like what is so cool and across your career, you you've worked in, it sounds like game, product, tech sales, angel investing. So there's so much that we can dig into, but before we even get to like that beginning of your career, can you talk to us? Take us back to the very beginning. Where did you grow up? What was your childhood like? What were you like as a kid and what kind of informed what's to come in your career?
Stevie Case (01:34.062)
That's great.
Stevie Case (01:59.258)
my goodness. So I grew up outside of Kansas City and my parents were, my dad was a lifelong teacher, mostly public school teacher. My mom was a nurse and then a social worker. So I grew up very much with this, just work ethic and this idea that a lot of life was about being of service and being of service to the people around you and to people you care about.
And it was great. I grew up outside my dad being a biology teacher We had this like 300 acre plot of land that we ended up living on it was original tall grass prairie and her job was to try to save it and protect it and so ultimately my whole childhood we were raising money to protect the land and like taking care of it and ultimately it became a state park so it was protected, but I had this very not
businessy childhood, I had no exposure to business, to entrepreneurship, to any of it. And it was an incredible way to grow up, but I didn't know what I didn't know. I certainly didn't have a passport. I had no exposure to much beyond all that we were doing there on the prairie in Kansas. And I didn't end up leaving the school.
Conscious Success Co (03:19.271)
such a different world from like, then being in, you know, like a tech sales leader in the Bay Area today. And I'm also curious about that, like having a parent who, you know, was a teacher and a social worker, what was the understanding you had of like, whether money was like good or bad and what you should focus on or aim towards in your career, because those are such like of service types of professions, which can be, you know, very different than, you know,
Stevie Case (03:24.366)
Yes.
Conscious Success Co (03:48.329)
tech sales, for example.
Stevie Case (03:49.994)
Yeah, mean money was not a topic. We definitely did not have a lot of it. It was not something we focused on or talked about though and
I remember even in my early 20s as I was getting into video games and I got a little more exposure to the world. I'll never forget I was featured in this Working Woman's magazine at one point when I was like 21. And one of the other women featured in this was somehow doing something in Silicon Valley. And she said something in this article about how money is everywhere. It's very easy to raise millions of dollars. And I was just like, can't, I don't, this does not.
compute for me. I don't understand how anyone has access to any money, let alone someone saying it's easy to have access to money. It was just completely foreign concept to me. I didn't know people with money. I had no exposure to how you get money. So all of this was totally unknown to me growing up. It was just not something we talked about.
Conscious Success Co (04:56.809)
So interesting. And did it feel like something you wanted to like learn more about and get closer to? Or was there any stigma against it?
Stevie Case (05:06.254)
Yeah, it was definitely just maybe not stigma entirely, but it wasn't the focus and it was not something I thought about. I was more a kid who was, I grew up very competitive. I was always competitive.
It was so extreme that I was so competitive that I developed a reputation among my friends and other kids at school that they didn't want me, they didn't want to invite me to stuff or have me participate. I literally had a friend say, you cannot come to the birthday party. We are going to roller skate and you don't need to be the best roller skater. We are over it.
Conscious Success Co (05:43.167)
You're like, they didn't want to lose because I was the best at everything.
Stevie Case (05:46.494)
Exactly, exactly. And that was kind of the thing. I love to win. So it super competitive, but I never really considered applying that to business or anything like that. Initially in my life, I applied it to sports. Like I was a big athlete. was female freshman athlete of the year in high school and like I played everything, but I never considered that I could apply that to business or to making money in some way.
Conscious Success Co (06:13.481)
So what did you want to be as a kid when you grew up? Like what was in your frame of consciousness?
Stevie Case (06:19.424)
I wanted to be president of the United States as all competitive children too. And that led to, as I grew up, I really started thinking more about law and politics, studying law. And it was my intention eventually to study law and become a constitutional lawyer and pursue that path as a path towards politics. But...
I thought of politics as a way to be of service to people. I thought you're a public servant and that job is helping people. think as I got older and I saw how cynical so much of it was, it lost a lot of its luster for me. that led me to that is the intention. just found, unfortunately, most people did not actually pursue it that way. And that's when I was like, OK, I'm
Conscious Success Co (07:00.691)
mean, that's what it should be. It's not what it has become, but.
Conscious Success Co (07:09.727)
Hmm.
Stevie Case (07:12.14)
I felt a little lost in those early college days of starting to realize, maybe people aren't pursuing politics as a way to help other people.
Conscious Success Co (07:21.053)
Hmm. So you're in college, you're really competitive, you think, okay, maybe I can be president, maybe I'll go the law route and politics, then talk to us how you got into competitive professional gaming.
Stevie Case (07:36.19)
It was totally accidental. I was living in the dorms at the University of Kansas and I had all these super smart friends and Doom was out at the time, which was an early first person shooter and I got introduced to that. They were showing me Doom. I played a little bit of that and it was fun. And then the next version of that came out, which was Quake and Quake was this 3D first person shooter and it was one of the first games where you could play multiplayer online.
with other people. So we started playing each other in the dorm just on a local network and then we were playing online when that was possible and my competitive streak just really came out and I got pretty good at it and the team this team I was on of people playing Quake there were about eight of us it was seven guys and me but I I was really into it so we started playing other teams we ended up being and we won like the first ever
Quake Clan Tournament, which was like a team tournament. And then what really turned into the snowball that led to pro gaming was I had an opportunity to go down to Dallas. That's where a lot of the first person shooters were being made. And I was introduced to the guys that made Quake. And one of my friends threw down a challenge and told the designer of the game, hey, she thinks she can beat you. should play her. And it turned into this.
Conscious Success Co (09:03.045)
You hadn't told your friend that. They just said that on your behalf.
Stevie Case (09:06.848)
Yes, yeah, he offered this up on my behalf, not my idea, but this became this big challenge and we agreed to a best of three and I came back another couple of months later and we ended up playing live in person and I beat him and
Conscious Success Co (09:22.843)
his own game.
Stevie Case (09:24.104)
his own game that he was notoriously like very passionate about and quite good at and so to beat him at this best of three that and there were like game magazines covering this and it turned into a thing and so after I won that that's when the gaming thing really took off.
Conscious Success Co (09:43.005)
That is wild. like you obviously were really good as you had this history of like, if I put my mind to anything, I'm going to compete, I'm going to get good, I'm going to put in the reps, I'm going to figure out how to be excellent and win. And then you beat a man at the game he designed and created and get all of this like press around. mean, that's just like so bad ass for all the women listening. Like, amazing. I love that story so much.
Stevie Case (10:05.176)
Thank you.
Conscious Success Co (10:09.385)
So then what happened from there as you started to like get this notoriety?
Stevie Case (10:13.75)
Well, it kind of turned into this much larger opportunity. So I ended up getting offers from like joystick companies and all these other gaming companies to sponsor me. So I had sponsors. I got to travel and compete at different video games. And it was really eye opening because for the first time I got to leave the US. I traveled to Europe. I got to go to South Korea to the World Cyber Games and I got all this.
exposure to the world. So I was technically at this point a pro gamer. I wasn't making a lot of money, but I was making enough to support myself and to drop out of college, very off brand and parents very unhappy. But no.
Conscious Success Co (10:52.585)
Were you still in school or is this after college?
Conscious Success Co (11:01.407)
You're like, I'm not probably gonna be president. I'm actually gonna drop out and become a pro gamer if that's okay with you.
Stevie Case (11:06.656)
I'm like, yeah, and there was no if that's okay with you. And I'm sure they were not happy about that either. I literally showed up at their house one day, because I went to school about 45 minutes from where I grew up. And I showed up in a U-Haul like one night and I was like, hey guys, I'm going to move to Texas. And like, can I put my stuff in the truck and I'm going tonight? And so they were super upset and they were just baffled. They're like, what are you doing? Like you were on this track.
Conscious Success Co (11:10.61)
Yeah.
Conscious Success Co (11:34.439)
Where did you source that confidence from to be like, hey, I'm going to drop out of college. I'm going to disappoint my parents. I'm going to trust my gut or whatever it was enough. How did you… Because I think for a lot of people listening, parental expectations can be huge. To overcome that, especially at such a young age, how did you do that?
Stevie Case (11:36.074)
And now you're...
Stevie Case (11:57.582)
Okay, this is gonna sound bad, but I never cared about that. That was like a, I was built very young.
to just be super independent and do my thing. And so to a fault, I did not care what anybody thought about what I was doing, good or bad. I was just, I was gonna do what I wanted to do. it did bother me later on that they were like so upset and disappointed. I was a little surprised because part of me was like, look, I have always made my own decisions and generally speaking, they've worked out pretty well.
but they were definitely very unhappy with this one and I was just sort of like, well, this is what I'm doing. I'm going and you just have to deal with it.
Conscious Success Co (12:47.635)
I mean, think that's so inspiring and what a gift to be like, I don't care what anyone else thinks. mean, I've had to do a lot of work in my life to largely get to that place today, but that was not like inherent in me. And I think that to be able to have that and be like, I'm going to follow what I want and I'm going to do what I want. I mean, that obviously has led to great things, but that can be such a struggle.
Sure, now your parents looking back are like, okay, it all worked out, but at the time, that was probably really scary for them.
Stevie Case (13:21.078)
It definitely was. And I think they were worried about, you know, where was it all headed? And I didn't necessarily have a plan. I knew where I...
Conscious Success Co (13:28.627)
You couldn't tell them. It's not like you knew exactly what it was gonna end up like.
Stevie Case (13:33.086)
No, not at all. Like I had a general sense of what I wanted to do in life. But when I was moving to Texas, I was thinking about that moment and what I was going to do when I got there. I was not thinking about like what my career was going to be. Like I, you know, I had a certain amount of faith those things would work out. I do think like for good or bad, I have always made those kind of bets on myself. And I think I've probably gone in with maybe an unhealthy level of confidence that like I'll figure it out.
But I've never been the one to have like a long-term career plan. It's just not in my DNA. And I think that that's part of what's enabled me to make some of these less traditional decisions because I'm not deviating from some big plan I had. Like I am thoughtful about where I'm going, but I'm not, I don't have the next 10 years, 20 years planned out.
Conscious Success Co (14:27.743)
Totally. And I think so often we're asked those questions like, what's your five-year plan? What's your 10-year plan? And yes, there's value to having a vision of what energizes you and excites you and directionally where you're going. But oftentimes it can be a hindrance when we're like trying to overly control and, you know, know exactly A to Z because we're missing the magic of like that co-creative power with the universe where you're pivoting and understanding where things are flowing and what is energizing you if you're just trying to stay to that like.
structure, there's not the balance. And so it sounds like you were intentional about choices, but you also gave a lot of room for that, like, feeling of how that was transpiring or unfolding to take place.
Stevie Case (15:08.492)
That is very true. And I have really gotten better over time about just getting that read on how I'm feeling about what I'm doing in the moment, in the current journey that I'm on, and trusting that instead of feeling like, I'm supposed to be doing something else.
Because in that time frame, did think, like I had that in the back of my mind, like, you're supposed to have like a five year plan or a 10 year plan. And people would ask me, like, I don't know. Like, I don't, that's not how I think about the world. But I did have that doubting thought in the back of my mind that I wasn't doing it right somehow. But it has allowed me a lot of freedom and it's allowed me to pivot a bunch of times.
to things that were non-obvious but ended up being incredible opportunities.
Conscious Success Co (16:00.987)
And what did you have as your guiding principles or filters for decision making as you moved or pivoted?
Stevie Case (16:11.342)
You know, in those early days, I did not have many. I was really just trusting my gut. I thought there is something unique here and I want to lean into it. I think probably one of the only principles I really had for those really through my like late 20s, early 30s was...
If something makes me uncomfortable, there's probably something to learn from it. And so I should lean into fear and I should lean into discomfort and that should drive the things that I'm trying because I thought I really want to open, I want to open my horizons. I want to like get more exposure to the world and I want to lean into things that I don't know about. And so.
What I would tell myself when opportunities came up or I was making choices was if it feels scary, it's probably the right thing. So trust that and just lean into the fear and say yes and go do it.
Conscious Success Co (17:07.165)
So interesting because I think that can be such good advice because we have these growth edges and our brains are always trying to keep us safe and in that keep us small, right? And so leaning into that fear, especially if behind that is like desire of what you actually want to learn or the ways you want to grow, that's a really good strategy. But sometimes that can get confusing where you're like, is this actually toxic or misaligned, but I just need to like lean in and push through. Like, how do you discern between the two?
Stevie Case (17:35.394)
That came much later. So that is the downside of that leaning into discomfort is, my gosh, I got myself into all kinds of toxic and scary and otherwise like not optimal situations in those early days. And I look back and I'm just like, my gosh, thank goodness I made it through all that. You know, there are.
Conscious Success Co (17:37.407)
Okay.
Stevie Case (17:59.342)
There were all kinds of situations there where I definitely wasn't in a safe space or wasn't in a place that in retrospect I probably should have been in or should have even wanted to be in. But I try to remind myself that like that is the flip side of the coin of taking those risks. And it has all come together to make me who I am.
I'm much more conscious about that now. think the thing that really shifted for me in my, it wasn't really honestly until my late 30s, early 40s was I started to really understand how to set boundaries and what was healthy for me. And I finally felt at that point, I was in a position of sufficient stability and power that I could enforce those boundaries in a meaningful way. But
That concept did not exist for me until much later in my life. And, you know, I try to just not have regrets about that and give myself some grace because I had never been exposed to that concept of boundaries. And I just thought, this is the world. I'm going for it.
Conscious Success Co (19:03.999)
And you.
Conscious Success Co (19:07.857)
Right. And like we have to run into walls and make mistakes to learn from them. So it sounds like, you know, all of that led you to where you ultimately are today and what you learned. And, know, that is a journey. We don't like come out fully formed and knowing all of these things. Right. But I'm curious, especially like being, you know, the first female professional video game player, obviously you were in a completely male dominated industry as like the only woman in most of these rooms. How do you think that?
being the only woman kind of informed the way you saw the world or showed up in business or how you adapted or thought as a result of that.
Stevie Case (19:46.35)
It changed me in some pretty fundamental ways. I definitely became stronger. became somebody, I feel like I could walk into any room and be comfortable. I'm not easily intimidated is one of the big things it did for me because I have been the only woman in the room for a couple of decades.
you get used to that and you get used to what comes with it. So like the intimidation factor went away and I think I was able to shift to more of a mindset of why not me? I think sometimes people get that, well, there's a huge position or opportunity, why me? I was able to shift to, why not me? Because I got exposure to some of these very successful people, very successful men and what I realized was,
They were insecure. They were just as fallible as anybody else. They really knew very little beyond what everybody else knew. It's like a demystified success in a way. And I walked out of that realizing like, they're not special. They're not any different. So there's no reason I can't have a seat at that table because I'm...
just as good. So it did a lot of that for me. It definitely also created some scar tissue. You know, I had a whole period after leaving gaming of where I just really felt like I couldn't claim my own voice and I sort of backed away from the internet. I wanted to create real space from it and really didn't want to identify with it for quite a while. And I found
equilibrium since then and I feel like I've reclaimed my voice but there was definitely like a solid decade where I felt like I just need real distance from this.
Conscious Success Co (21:38.003)
What led you to feel like you couldn't claim your voice and had to take that step back?
Stevie Case (21:42.644)
So the TLDR of the story was through that whole journey, that guy I beat at the video game, I ended up dating him. that ill-advised, very ill-advised, but you know, I was young and you do what you do.
And that when that relationship ended, he was very powerful in that industry. And he decided if I was not willing to be with him, that he would ruin my life is what he told me. He said, I'm going to ruin your life. And he went about trying to do that and basically blackballed me in the industry. I was on the precipice of getting a great job right after that. And he called the company and told them not to hire me. And they didn't. And so I
I went through this whole period of being very afraid of being ashamed because, of course, he felt no shame, but all the shame was put on me as the woman in the relationship. And he got to tell the story of what happened, and he was very creative in his telling of that story. And I would argue very inaccurate in the way he told it. But because he was powerful, his narrative won.
And so I felt like I just need to get away from this. I've got to go find space for myself that is not near this.
Conscious Success Co (23:04.199)
And was there any part of you that wanted to like tell your own narrative and fight that? Or was there a part of you that internalized his narrative and are like, maybe I don't trust myself or believe myself in the same way because now everyone believes this, so am I crazy? Like, how did you internalize that?
Stevie Case (23:19.478)
I did not internalize his narrative. I knew it was a lie, but I also saw how effective he was at telling that story and how quickly everyone around us bought it. Everyone, including our friends. He even, it was very toxic. Like he even called my own brother. He called my brother and tried to turn my own brother against me. Like he was.
Conscious Success Co (23:45.023)
What an asshole!
Stevie Case (23:46.594)
It was pretty bad. It was pretty bad. like he was effective at it. So I knew my truth and I didn't internalize the story, but man, I saw how effective he had been. And that made me scared and it made me angry. And I thought I just need to go make a new life basically, because he has poisoned the well of the entire life that I knew. And so I need to go just start over. So and I thought to myself,
That's fine. I bet on myself, I'm gonna go somewhere else and I'm gonna start over and I know I'm capable of that and I just need to get away from this and try again.
Conscious Success Co (24:23.679)
Well, at least you had that internal confidence that you knew you could start again and you had a track record to prove that you'd be able to be successful in doing so. But that's a really traumatic and difficult thing to navigate, especially as a young woman. So talk to us about what did you set your sights on next and what did that next chapter look like?
Stevie Case (24:46.542)
I'd say that next chapter was probably like my most reactive and least thoughtful chapter in that I felt like I was running away from something and that is very much not me typically. But you know, I ran off to LA. I continued to work a bit in video games and I continued to do my thing. I had some kind of interesting opportunities out there. I ended up working at Warner Brothers, making video games. That was cool.
but I still felt like I was at the periphery of this world that had become very toxic. So...
As I was out there, I had a really interesting opportunity arise. I was making games at Warner Brothers and I had a guy who was a vendor who was selling me tech. He was selling me tech at Warner Brothers and he approached me one day and said, hey, I need a junior salesperson and I think I could teach you how to sell. Like, would you come work for me?
And this was another one of these. Like I had never considered sales. I was very shy. Like I had learned to mask it, but I've always been a very shy person. And so sales to me was like deep discomfort. But like that little voice showed up again and I thought, if I'm scared, I should probably do this because this will make me better somehow. So I said yes to that. And that was really the beginning of a
next chapter.
Conscious Success Co (26:18.909)
And what do you think that vendor saw in you as a self-identified, shy person that was like, she would be great in sales?
Stevie Case (26:26.606)
Frankly, I have no idea. I don't know if he was just delusional or what. I mean, I was really, I've always been very passionate about my work. It could be that he saw that. I don't know what it was, but for some reason he decided to.
Conscious Success Co (26:28.563)
Hahaha
Stevie Case (26:43.086)
placed a bet on me and that ended up being just this incredible opportunity. He took me on. This is, you know, now 18 years ago. So this is really when people still went and sold technology in person. So I just got to go on the road with him and he would do the thing. He would sell and I would get to see how it worked.
And so, you know, I was really terrible at it at first, but I kept watching and he gave me great feedback and bit by bit I learned how to do this job. And after a while I was like, I actually kind of like this. This is interesting.
Conscious Success Co (27:19.421)
And it has that whole like competitive thing to it, right? And you you've proven like you can learn anything and to have someone who can show you by example. And I mean, I remember that before you ever became my manager at Twilio being like, I just need to like sit near this person on the sales floor because you were like absolutely crushing it. And I'm like, can I just like sit in a meeting? Because if I can just see how this rock star is doing it, like I'll be able to figure it out kind of thing. And having these people that you can
watch if you're a sponge, if you're curious, if you're actually trying to learn, like you can. And I think that's just like such an important thing for people to hear. It's like you could pick any industry and if you come into it and you have those types of mentors and you are willing to like learn and throw yourself in, like there's no limit to what you can do and pivot and learn.
Stevie Case (28:09.902)
I think that's everything. When I look back at all the pivots in my career, in every case there was one key person that in most cases they did not formally mentor me, but they were people that I looked up to and I saw them doing something that I wanted to try to learn how to do. And I did kind of what you're describing. Like, can I sit near them? Can I get close to them? Can I figure out how they think about the world? And then can I try to replicate it? And that has been
the thing that has powered so many of my big pivots and my big opportunities. And you find those magical people in these great circumstances, and as long as you're paying attention and you're ready to learn, that's really all it takes.
Conscious Success Co (28:54.813)
And, you know, I always talk with clients about, if you go follow, like, a great mentor, someone you can really learn under, even if you're taking a step back from in your earning potential or your title, like, it will all come back to you in time, right? But, like, follow those people who can really, who you can really learn from and are willing, you know, at some level, consciously or not, to invest and share that knowledge with you. And, like, that is more important than...
I'm going to optimize for like 10K more in this job offer and a manager who doesn't care or I can't learn under.
Stevie Case (29:30.636)
Yeah, I could not agree more. It really is everything. And I see this now. I've got a really big team now. I do a lot of hiring. And you see this mistake that people frequently make, which is they are trying to optimize for either the most senior title or the highest compensation. And it leads them to take a job that doesn't challenge them. And where there may be a big fish in a small pond, there's nobody to learn from.
those people don't go nearly as far. Like it's not impressive that you've got a big title on your resume if you didn't learn there. I would far rather hire somebody who had a more junior title but is a learner and worked with incredible people, worked in a situation where they were learning a lot. Like those are the things that I look for.
Conscious Success Co (30:19.807)
100%. So at this time, as you're learning under this person, you also had your daughter already. Is that right?
Stevie Case (30:28.024)
I did. She was just like one year old at that point. She was super little.
Conscious Success Co (30:32.543)
Okay, wow. So you're also, pivoting, you're a new mother, you're also, sounds like on the road as sales was at that time, like how are you navigating that? Because as a mother of like two young children now, I'm like, my gosh, like forced to reckon with so many things I didn't even understand prior to motherhood. And then thinking about that as a single mother in the time that you were doing it, like that like boggles my mind. So talk to us about that.
Stevie Case (31:01.518)
Yeah, in a way, think that like that journey. I was, you know, had my daughter with my husband and we were together until she was just about two and a half. And then when we broke up, I became a single mom with full custody unexpectedly. And so I was in the midst of this career journey and starting to do sales and do all of this. And then all of sudden I was without a co-parent and
At the time, it felt incredibly hard. Like we had been living in Seattle, so I took my daughter and we moved to the Bay Area so I could be closer to where my office was at that company that I was working at. And at the time, I just remember in that whole divorce, I basically traded the kid for money. So he took all the money, I took the kid.
I got the better deal for sure. But I showed up in the Bay Area with basically nothing. And as a single mom, he took all my money. Correct. Yes. That was the divorce settlement. And that was the deal that got cut for reasons that at the time made sense. But yeah, we're definitely not fair. But yeah, he took all of our joint money, including mine. And so came to the Bay Area with her.
Conscious Success Co (31:59.038)
When you say he took all the money, he took your money with him.
Stevie Case (32:22.208)
and was in this early pivot to sales, learning to sell, and at same time, trying to figure out how to survive as a single parent and keep her in a great school and safe and clean. Money was so tight. I was literally doing the sales job during the day, and the only thing I could do to make extra money to get by was babysit because I could bring her with me. So I was like,
babysitting in the evening and on the weekends with her and then selling during the day. I I remember during that time having to pick her up from daycare and I was like in the middle of doing sales calls. So I would be pitching and I would say, I'm sorry, I to pause for just a second. I would mute the phone and then like take her through the drive-through at McDonald's or something. You know, it was just like total chaos to a certain extent.
I would have to pick her up at day care by 6 p.m. and I had to leave my office by 5.01. So I was just cutting it so close in every way. So it was intense, but at same time, there was like a real desire to succeed. Like the fire to really succeed started there.
because now I wasn't just doing it for me, I also had this child to support and I wanted her to have a great life. So it drove a lot of my success from that point forward because I was determined to make it.
Conscious Success Co (33:55.648)
So do you think it made you bolder in your career decisions or do you think it made you more cautious in the risk you were willing to take?
Stevie Case (34:03.01)
I think it made me a little more cautious in some ways. So the way that earlier in my life, I would just lean into anything, any discomfort, any scary situation, I didn't do that so much anymore, but it made me more aggressive in chasing success. So I was a little more single-minded, a little more focused, and I was just driven.
And I was in this mode where I was not gonna let anybody around me know how much I was struggling. So I was just zoned in and I was gonna crush my quota. I was gonna prove to everybody around me that I could be super successful. That's when I started to really figure out, I knew I needed to ladder up how much money I was making. So then I started figuring out that game of like, how do I climb the ladder here and actually increase my income? So I became more intentional.
And in that, I was focused on increasing my income in a very deliberate way.
Conscious Success Co (35:01.021)
And so you obviously honed this skill of selling and you moved up and became like a VP of sales, is that right? So you were then a people leader and leading more strategy too, I assume, across these teams. So is that what you were doing well and then able to get promotions and able to move companies as needed to increase your earning potential? Or what did that kind of laddering up look like?
Stevie Case (35:10.904)
That's right.
Stevie Case (35:16.75)
Mm-hmm.
Stevie Case (35:27.532)
made.
a few key moves in that time frame. So I did move up into like a sales manager type of position. And then I there was a series of companies where I was able to move to a competitor company and they were eager to recruit me. So I got I remember it was a very significant pay bump and I made that move. And then at that company there was a guy doing business development and he left and I managed to like get into
to his role, so I got another raise there, and then another competitor came and recruited me. So I kind of made this laddered move across three competitors, and in the course of those moves, I doubled my salary. And then I was like, okay, I'm figuring it out. I'm figuring the game out. And from there, then I started to really hone in on, okay, now I'm leading a sales team.
what does the next level up of this game look like? And I ended up joining a company, leading a sales team. It was like a very chaotic startup, but I came in as the VP sales and about six months after I joined, we got acquired by Visa. And it was like, it was the first time I experienced any kind of like liquidity, any kind of exit event of any kind.
And I will never forget because I made $50,000 out of that acquisition. And at the time, I was like, I am so rich. I am like, have made it. I know I was like, my mind was blown and I went out and I will never forget I bought myself a new mattress. And it was like, I am living a life of luxury. I have a new mattress. I am like,
Conscious Success Co (37:05.275)
$50,000? What are we gonna do with all this money?
Stevie Case (37:20.662)
flush with this the rest of the cash and that was like my first taste of like Silicon Valley there's acquisitions and this is what it looks like so that was like okay that was another moment where I saw another layer of what was possible.
Conscious Success Co (37:39.52)
So at some point you moved to Lair and then you came over to Twilio, which is where we met, right? And so you were, you had been like a sales leader at that point, but when you came to Twilio, you were an individual contributor, enterprise rep. Can you talk to us about that decision to like kind of take a step back or what did that look like for you when you were already like leading teams and had this more senior title that led you to make that choice?
Stevie Case (37:47.085)
Yes.
Stevie Case (38:09.439)
Yeah, this was an interesting decision point for me. So after Visa, went to this company layer where I was the first non-technical hire. I got to run everything customer facing and build sales and support and success. And so it was another leadership role. And my hope had been that I was betting on a startup and we would have some kind of exit event. I spent a few years there. I did their first million in ARR. was a great experience, but felt like I was playing almost like a co-founder like role.
was clear to me we were not gonna have a big exit. So I started having conversations with friends. I knew one of the senior engineers at Twilio and he and I chatted and the thing I saw was here's a company that clearly, there's some magic happening here. Like there's very smart people, there's a lot of growth and I thought more than anything, I just wanna be a part of this company.
I don't care so much what seat I'm in, I just want to get there because it's clear they're going to be successful. And so I interviewed and I got offered two different options. They had just done some promotions, so they didn't really have any direct sales leadership roles open. So the VP sales said, I can give you a leadership role, but it's going to be like running a partnerships team. It's going to be a little different, but it'll be the right level of seniority for you or.
we're gonna build an enterprise sales team for the first time. You could be like one of our very first enterprise salespeople and you could crush a quota and come help us build our enterprise business. And he, you know, talked a big game as great sales leaders do saying like, we wanna pay a salesperson a million dollars a year and you could come do that.
And I thought, okay, this is like, if this is an opportunity to bet on myself, I know I want to be at this company. I will take that enterprise AE role because it's a bet on myself and it's wild west. Nobody's done it there before. So it's an opportunity for me to build something, improve something. And so that's what I ended up doing. And I ended up being in that salesperson role for two and a half years, which was amazing. In retrospect, I am so glad I made that decision.
Conscious Success Co (40:26.163)
And I think that's so also important for everyone listening to be like sometimes in your career, it's going to make sense to again, take that title drop or step back if you're with smart people in a place you can learn in a company you think has a really promising future because I think a lot of people from just like a sheer ego perspective wouldn't have done that, right? And you were like, okay, I'm willing to, or I'm not gonna just take the partnerships role even though that would allow me to have the seniority.
Stevie Case (40:48.173)
Yeah.
Conscious Success Co (40:53.907)
I'll bet on myself, I bet I can make money. And also you then were able to like learn and figure out what selling at this company really looked like. And for those listening who don't know, this was a platform, API, communications platform. So we were integrating into all these other B2C companies for the most part software stacks. And so it was a very complex sale. And so to come in and get that experience as a seller,
I imagine also really served you as you moved into leadership.
Stevie Case (41:26.254)
Absolutely. Like if I had not done that, I don't know that I would have had success at Twilio. Like I don't think if I had picked the more senior role that didn't fit my skills, I might not have been there long. You know, I just don't think I would have learned the right things. And ultimately being a seller for those two and a half years, I got to see very hands on what the platform did. So I learned the business deeply. I got to speak to hundreds of customers, which
was incredible. So the education was amazing. And because I was one of the first in that role, I got to show the company what success looked like doing that. I got to like do business building in a way that was really unique. And I resisted for a long time. Like even after a year, we started talking about maybe
moving me into a leadership role. And I really resisted for a while because it's like I'm having fun and I can control my own destiny here and I'm closing great deals. I think my first 18 months I closed more than 20 Fortune 500 logos. Like it was wild. It was wild. It was so much fun. So I was very happy with that choice.
Conscious Success Co (42:37.311)
scene.
Conscious Success Co (42:43.943)
Yes, and I also remember we were laughing at this before we hit record, but at one point we had the world's most complex sales plan, and you and I were sitting together and trying to explain to leadership who hadn't really sold, like why it made no sense or like why this wasn't motivating the right behaviors or whatever it was. And I feel like you said something like, need to be a Mensa member to understand this plan, and I am a Mensa member, and I still don't actually understand this plan.
Stevie Case (42:53.73)
Yes.
Conscious Success Co (43:12.819)
But I feel like you were able to challenge and advocate and push back in this collaborative way with leadership, which actually helped you to establish yourself as a leader and someone to be trusted. And I think not to put myself on your level, but one of the things I think I did do well as a seller there was to be willing to challenge the status quo and look where things weren't working, not just to bring
Stevie Case (43:36.845)
Yeah.
Conscious Success Co (43:40.64)
problems, but to also try to bring solutions and to work cross-functionally and to push us to get better. And something I see so much come up with clients, especially the women that I coach, is stepping into that kind of challenge or position can feel really scary for a lot of women. And it's like, who am I? Or I just need to be the good girl and take orders. But that's actually one of the things that we need to do as leaders. Can you talk to us about that?
Stevie Case (44:08.683)
Yeah.
I mean, I was so lucky to have come from leadership positions because I was very comfortable even in that IC role, advocating for change or saying what I thought was wrong. And ultimately, I think that that's what put me in a position to be able to move up into leadership there and to be promoted as quickly as I was. And I see this now with my own team. I really value the folks on my team who are
challenging the way we work and doing it in a way where they're bringing solutions or they're bringing a proposed change forward. Like I want that. I want high ownership. I want people to feel that kind of agency. And I feel very lucky that in that Twilio role I was in a position to bring that. And it really did set up the opportunity to be more of a partner with leadership. And part of that too, along that journey, it really made me realize
that I let our leaders also see me be very vulnerable. And I also think that was a big part of building trust. Like when we had George, our COO, join, I let him come on the road with me and come to every sales meeting with me. And some of those sales meetings were a mess. They were disastrous. But I was like, whatever. was secure enough in what I was doing that I was okay with him seeing that mess and seeing what was and was
working. And I see now from leadership role how valuable that is because so many folks, especially more junior folks, they want you to think they're perfect, they're buttoned up, everything is done exactly right. We all know that's not the case and it's so valuable to see the reality because then you can actually go fix it. So I think that was another component of what really worked there.
Conscious Success Co (46:01.248)
Yes, 100%. And when you can see that as like, okay, yeah, that sales meeting might've been a mess, but there's something that now we can learn from it, he can take from it, the company can better itself because of that information versus like, I'm the problem, I'm a failure, and internalizing it. Like, I think that can be the biggest shift, and that's like a growth mindset and being willing to point out the problems, let them see the problems, let them see the mess, not pretend like you're...
a duck above water, like everything's cool, but kicking like hell. Like, yes, there's times where, of course, have things, you know, put together and up-level things in the right way. But having that transparency, having that vulnerability, it actually breeds more trust because leaders are like, if Stevie will show me this, I can trust what she's telling me. People don't trust when they say everything's perfect, everything's handled, right? We know that that's too good to be true.
Stevie Case (46:54.074)
No, absolutely. We all know there's mess there. And the big thing for me, especially with my team today, is I don't expect everybody in the org to be executing perfectly all the time. I'm very aware, especially for more junior ICs, that they're still learning and that it's not going to be perfect. The thing I'm looking for is do they care? And are they trying to get better? And if the answers to those two things are yes,
In the vast majority of cases, I am going to promote those folks. I'm going to keep them in the org. It's really about that growth mindset and the willingness to continue to improve. If they try to pretend they're perfect, it actually makes me question what they're doing because I know it's not true. And the folks who are going to be more real and open up are the ones that are really providing a lot of value because we can all get better together.
Conscious Success Co (47:49.952)
Totally. Yeah, and something I talk with clients a lot about is that when we suffer from perfectionism, we think I need to be superhuman or I'm subhuman. And when we have high self-worth or self-confidence, we're like, I'm human. And to be human is to be limited and to be fallible. And that's OK. That doesn't make me unworthy. And so we actually, being able to show that you have weaknesses or those vulnerabilities or that you don't have it all put together is actually a signal of higher self-confidence.
than that actually like bravado or projection of perfection, which again comes from shame and feeling like you're not actually good enough.
Stevie Case (48:21.198)
this.
Stevie Case (48:26.7)
that is very real. And I see that show up every day on my team. And for me, it took me a long time to really internalize that, because I think it is scary to expose those growth edges, but.
It's something now that I've really incorporated into how I lead is I try to be very real in the things I don't do well or the things I don't know how to do because the truth is every leader at every layer is just a person and there's a lot we don't know. There's a lot we don't do well and I think the more you can own that, the more permission you give the people around you to be real as well.
Conscious Success Co (49:05.853)
And how do you balance trying to let folks know, hey, I have a plan, I have a vision, there's a strategy here, I know what I'm doing with that vulnerability of I don't have it all under control all the time and I am fallible. I know when I moved into leadership, that was really hard for me because I wanted to be able to hire great people to come work for me and I wanted to be able to let them think, hey, I'm gonna fix things and there is a strategy and there's a place that we're going, but at the same time.
Half the time I was like, I don't actually know so much. So like, what's the balance there?
Stevie Case (49:40.962)
You know, I think part of it is just not overdoing it on that, hey, I don't know everything and I'm human. Like there's a healthy level of that without going too far. And then I think you just have to prove it to people over time. I think when you show up with passion and you show up with conviction and your team can see that while you might not do everything perfectly, they know that they can count on you to show up. They know you're going to keep trying and you're articulating the why.
behind your decisions, then they start to be able to count on you and how they can expect you to act in any given situation. I think it's that consistency and it's exposing your thinking that allows people to build that trust with you and then relax a little bit knowing that like, okay, every decision might not be perfect, but like I know where it's coming from and I trust the intention and then we can all sort of move forward together. And then you can also be more open to feedback under those circumstances as well.
Conscious Success Co (50:41.385)
Right, and if you bring them along with your thinking and your why and how you got there, even if it is imperfect or if you change your mind later, if you can help them to understand why, they'll stay with you. Yeah. So you moved then from an enterprise seller up into be a regional sales director. You were at different points, the VP of mid-market and of enterprise sales. at the time, Twilio was growing like wild f***.
Stevie Case (50:53.42)
Yeah, absolutely.
Conscious Success Co (51:10.367)
It was really scaling as an organization. I'm curious looking back, what were the biggest things you learned or ways that you grew the most? Or what did you really take from that chapter at Twilio?
Stevie Case (51:25.55)
Biggest thing I took away was that playbook for how to scale an organization. I was so lucky there that the person that I got to sit near that had the playbook and like a secret magic that I got to learn from was George Hu, our COO, who came over. had been the right hand guy, as you know, to Mark Benioff at Salesforce. So he knew this scaling playbook and...
I got to really have a lot of interaction with him because our sales team was so small early on and I took him on the road and brought him into sales meetings. We spent all this time.
And then what I got to watch him do was educate our CEO on the scaling playbook. Cause when we all arrived, Jeff, our CEO had this grand vision that we were going to become a billion dollar run rate company. And at the time I think we were doing about 200 million in ARR and it sort of here's where we're coming from. Correct.
Conscious Success Co (52:22.355)
And he wanted to do it through developer first, like not sales.
Stevie Case (52:26.07)
Yeah, yeah, he's like, we were like, how's this gonna work? And he's like, we're gonna make great products. And you know, there was like a vision, but there wasn't really a plan to execute, other than like, we're gonna make great products. And when George arrived, was like, actually, there is a playbook for how you do this. And he brought this operational model and the math and like the whole playbook for how you scale an organization to become a billion dollar run rate.
And while he educated the leadership team, I got to sit near him and watch what he was doing and learn that playbook and sit in the meetings and hear the strategy. And as he did those things, like that scaling playbook, if I had not gotten that exposure, I would not be the chief revenue officer today. Like that.
was something I could not have learned anywhere else. That is not written in a book anywhere. I got to learn from somebody who had done it at one of the biggest companies on earth. And that is the magic that allowed me to unlock that next part of my journey.
Conscious Success Co (53:28.991)
And just another example of being a sponge, being near the right people, being willing to prioritize that learning and seeing how if I can get that scaling playbook, ultimately that could get me further where I may want to go, but being willing to optimize for that in the short term. And so you were at Twilio for around six years, I think. And then ultimately you made the decision to leave and went and became the CRO of Vanta. I'm curious.
How did you know it was time to leave Twilio? Like, what did that feel like? What were the signals? And was that more of a, like, pull and going towards something bigger, like a CRO role, or was it more of a push and, like, this company doesn't feel good anymore and I need to move on? Or both?
Stevie Case (54:15.982)
It was very tough. was, I did not want to leave. Like I really thought I wanted to be a lifer at this company. That was my intention. But a couple of things started to become really clear.
One of those was just the math. know, there are, this was one of the great things about being a sponge and like learning so much more about the business was it started to become very clear to me that we had a pretty serious margin problem. And so, you know, I was reading all of the analyst reports and I was looking at the metrics of the business and, you know, we were guiding the street that we were going to move towards like 60 % gross margin. But like,
In my bones, I didn't believe it. I had developed enough of an understanding of the business that I did not believe what we were saying. And that to me was the first red flag. Like, okay, if I don't believe it and I know really well how this company works, that's a problem. And that still was not enough because usually I see problems like that and I'm like, I want to be a part of fixing it. And I know there's a way to fix this. So that was the first flag.
second flag was really like a big culture shift. We had a new leader arrive and the culture changed dramatically and I wasn't happy. We kind of went from a world where I felt like really great about the culture and really great about the team and I felt empowered and I felt seen and I felt really accepted to a world where
It was clear that my style of leadership was no longer welcome on the team. And I wasn't being pushed out, but I definitely wasn't feeling the love. And I found that I was just waking up every day feeling awful. I was like, do I need anxiety medication? Do I need to medicate myself? What is wrong with me? I was miserable. On a human, deep human level, I was waking up sad.
Conscious Success Co (56:15.903)
Do I need to be medicated? I don't feel good.
Yeah.
Stevie Case (56:26.538)
And that is not a great feeling. And that had not been the way. it came to this point, I'm like, OK, I've been here six years. I am not happy. And I started raising my hand. And I told my leaders, I'm really struggling. I'm not feeling it. And they were sympathetic. They asked me to stay. And they asked me to stay for at least another six months. And I just hit this point where I had a conversation with my leader.
And I had gone out and started to have some conversations to see what else was in the market. But I had a conversation with my leader on a Friday and it felt so awful that I woke up on a Saturday morning and I emailed him my resignation. And I was just like, I can't do it. This is not for me anymore. I did not have a job accepted. Like I was interviewing, but I did not have a job. And I just thought this is no way to live. It's not worth it. And
I am going to bet on myself that I work this out and I'm going to go find something else.
Conscious Success Co (57:29.471)
I mean, it's so like healing, honestly. I've done a lot of work to heal this, but at some level to like hear this from you, because I experienced the same thing at the time, but I think we were doing this in silos at the time I was building, you know, a sales team in Europe. So I lost a little bit of that connection to the Bay Area, but at the same time, like, yeah, the margin pressure, the lack of understanding how we would really get there and if that was possible, and then this culture change. And I think unlike what you're saying where like, okay, I'm just going to go and bet on myself.
I stayed for far too long being like, I must be the problem that my team isn't able to be successful. I must be, you know, and that really led me to burnout. Like that led me to clinical burnout rather than being like, this doesn't feel good. And it's not that I need to be medicated. It's that all of my feelings are messengers and they're giving me signals that this is no longer a healthy place. And it was so hard because there was a lot of identity wrapped up in that, right? And I was there for eight years and six of those were
magical and wonderful. And so to have it shift and then not really understand what had changed, but it go from such an empowering, healthy organization to at that time kind of a toxic one and not get that, like it was really, really hard. And I think for a lot of the women that I coach and women listening, oftentimes we can make ourselves wrong. I know I did, or we stay too long, or we just try to like be the good soldier. But when something feels that bad and all of your feelings are telling you that like,
That's the time to go. That's the time to act on it. Like it's the time to pay attention and solve the right problem to solve. And it seems like you were able to do that. It wasn't as easy for me.
Stevie Case (58:58.808)
Yeah.
Stevie Case (59:06.182)
It was, I mean, it took me a while and it is hard because I think when you are a high agency and you do have so much identity tied up in not just the company, but like the type of leader you are trying to be and the type of person you want to be in an organization. I think that is often your first instinct is to look inward and say, what am I doing wrong? Like, what have I done in this organization incorrectly? And you start blaming yourself and internalizing and, you know, I have learned
to really fight that urge. And I can take responsibility for the things that I own without taking on everybody else's stuff. And that was the biggest lesson for me out of that was, are there things I could have done differently and better? Absolutely. think especially once things turned toxic, there's plenty I could have done differently. And.
the organization was no longer a fit for me. And it was really hard to come to terms with that at the time, but in retrospect, I am so glad I did. And I think my timing was just right on that front.
Conscious Success Co (01:00:18.313)
So yeah, you're now the CRO of Vanta, as we talked about, and you joined when it was just like early product market fit and taking it through series B and C and beyond. Talk to us about then like now being at the helm of a company, getting to be responsible for determining culture and strategy and all of that. Like, how has that been for you? And like, what is that shift like?
Stevie Case (01:00:44.046)
It has been incredibly intense. have loved it. I mean, it's such an honor to have the opportunity to build a team. And it has been a huge amount of growth. When I joined the company was about 150 people and had very clear, powerful product market fit. But on the go-to-market side, like it was all inbound, kind of barely using CRM, not really forecasting. Like it was a lot of vibes and, you know, a really awesome team of people, but like,
Fairleigh Junior team and from there I started with 20 people on my team. think as of this morning I've got about 600 people on my team globally.
Conscious Success Co (01:01:24.049)
In the sales, sales are related go-to-market functions. Wow.
Stevie Case (01:01:27.566)
Yes, yeah, in go-to-market. So I've got, I started with just North American sales. I now have global sales, SDR, rev ops, customer success, account management, partnerships and channel. Basically everything go-to-market except marketing. And it's a great crew. But at the same time, oh my gosh, like.
The first 18 months were very, very hard because there is not a playbook for this role for hyperscale startups. Like there really is not a playbook for this and made tons of mistakes, learned a lot.
But luckily we've got a great product, we've got a great team, and we've managed to manifest a ton of growth. Now, I think I would say 24 months in is when I felt like I really finally got my footing in earnest. And since that 24 month mark...
Now I'm confident I know how to do this job. There's still a lot I don't know. There's always gonna be a lot I don't know. But I know the fundamentals of how to do the CRO job successfully. And that has put me in a place of deep comfort where I know how to operate in this position now. But man, every first time CRO, the first 24 months, it's just, whew, it's like a right in frying pan.
Conscious Success Co (01:02:45.577)
But you had all this track record of leaning into the discomfort and the growth edge and trusting yourself to figure it out. And I think a lot of people reach that and they're like, no, abort or don't even put themselves up for that and say, why me? And you're saying, why not me? And to say, it's going to take 24 months before you can figure it out as a first time CRO. know, a lot of people don't figure it out, right? But it sounds like you have, and that's huge. I'm curious because…
I think many of us, especially when we're more junior, think our leaders have it all figured out and they've done it all before and they must know all the answers. But the reality is that we are making decisions with imperfect information, the best decisions we can. And yes, we're acting on data and intuition and all of that. But ultimately, especially as a CRO, you have to make big bets and calls that you can't be certain of. How do you give yourself grace if it doesn't go the direction that you thought it would? Or you make...
a mistake at a level that affects 600 people.
Stevie Case (01:03:42.186)
Yeah, there have been plenty of those moments. And I think that on the hard days or when it doesn't go well or when the bet doesn't pay off, I try to remind myself, I just wake up in the morning and I tell myself, I know that I am doing my best. And as long as I can trust myself on that and know that I'm giving it 100 % effort, I am giving it all of the care that I have, all of the energy I have.
Like I know I'm not gonna get everything right, so I just try to give myself grace from there. The only time I'm hard on myself is where I feel like I didn't give it the level of effort it deserved. And I've really come to trust myself that I do. I am giving it all the energy I've got. And sometimes I'm gonna get it wrong. And now when I do get it wrong, what I try to do is really just own that.
and move forward and not wallow in it. I try to learn from it what I can. I try to identify how the miss happened so I can build a playbook to avoid it the next time. And I just keep trying to iterate. And I think the thing that has kept me successful in this role is that I just keep showing up. Like I keep trying. I wake up every day and I'm like, well, we're just gonna keep trying today. And like we're gonna try new things and.
It reminds me of something George had said to me about the sea level roles. He said, the hardest thing is you wake up every day and you could do anything. And there's nobody to tell you what to do. So you have to decide. So at a certain point, you just have to decide you're going to be decisive and that you're going to give yourself grace knowing there will be mistakes. And
I think that the most important thing in all of that is that you're thoughtful about the impact of those mistakes on the humans. Because at of the day, I've got a team of 600 people that is depending on me. They have put their trust and their career in my hands. And so I want to be really thoughtful that the decisions I make take that into consideration.
Stevie Case (01:05:48.79)
and ultimately respect the humanity of that entire group of people. So my hope is to create like a, you know, I want this to be a career defining, incredible experience for everybody on the team. But at a minimum, I hope I do right by them and make the best decisions I can.
Conscious Success Co (01:06:05.821)
And that's such a healthy mindset to be like, hey, I know I'm putting in the effort and I'm doing the best I can. And that has to be like good enough if I'm going to be able to stay in this game and I'm trying to do right by people. And that's my intention and I'm growing. And anytime I don't get it right, I'm building the playbook or learning from it. And like, that's all we can really ask of anyone, leaders included. And I'm sure that that is felt and trickles down in your organization to build that kind of.
growth-oriented culture and positive culture instead of a toxic one because it is so often all the time maybe set from the top. So it's great to hear.
Stevie Case (01:06:42.67)
It's so true. And it's hard because I think that in these roles, everyone has an opinion about your work. And think one of the things I've had to come to terms with is that idea that there are plenty of times that people will not agree with my decisions, or they won't understand my intent, or I will come with good intent, but they won't see it and they'll misinterpret it as malice. And I just really, you have to ground yourself.
and you have to find that center and trust that as long as you know where you're coming from, you wanna take all that data in, it's valuable input, but you gotta trust your instincts and you gotta trust your intentions and move forward.
Conscious Success Co (01:07:25.103)
Okay, well I know we're at time. I just want to leave with one last question. If you could give women listening, especially those who are trying to navigate their ambition also with maybe motherhood and they're trying to figure out how to do this all well, like what would you tell them? What would be your biggest piece of advice?
Stevie Case (01:07:43.934)
My biggest piece of advice is there is no right way. There just isn't. And you have to trust yourself. And you know best what you want. You know what brings you joy. You know what makes you happy and what gives you energy. Trust that above everything else because you can write your own playbook.
There's no arbiter of a truth or what is right in the world. It is up to you. So write your own story and trust what truly brings you joy.
Conscious Success Co (01:08:15.721)
I love that so much. I always ask people that I'm interviewing, what does conscious success mean to you? And the answer you just gave also feels like the answer to that. Trust yourself, follow what gives you energy and brings you joy, and there's no arbiter, and build your own playbook. I think that that's so applicable to that as well. Stevie, thank you so much for being here. I know how busy you are. 600 people reporting in to you. You are...
Booked solid, so thank you for making this time to be here and share all your wisdom. I know there are so many nuggets people are gonna take away, so thank you.
Stevie Case (01:08:46.22)
Thank you so much. This has been a lot of fun.
