Conscious Success Co (00:00.994)
Hello, Vicki, welcome to the Conscious Success Podcast.
Vicky Charles (00:04.906)
Thank you Emma, I'm so excited to be here. I'm excited to talk to you.
Conscious Success Co (00:08.39)
I'm so happy that you are here. And so to let the listeners know, I worked for you back when I was like 22, 23 in New York at the Soho House. I think I was the world's worst assistant, but you were so… I think it very much is as a 22, 23… Well, I had no previous design experience. You were the global head of design for the Soho House.
Vicky Charles (00:23.446)
That's not true.
I've had so many worse ones. I'm just kidding.
Conscious Success Co (00:35.85)
I had a little bit of assistant experience, but at that age I was more probably interested in partying in the Hamptons and coming into work hungover than I probably should have been. Yep, that will trigger some memories, but we built such a strong personal relationship. And I just learned so much from you, both personally and professionally, not just about design, which I have and has informed all of my homes and the way that I think about it since then, but more importantly,
Vicky Charles (00:44.362)
I do remember that.
Vicky Charles (00:54.607)
Conscious Success Co (01:04.319)
about leadership and about stress management and how to overcome my perfectionism and motherhood and how to just be a good person that people want to work with. So I love you. look up to you so much and I'm just so happy and honored that you are here to share all your wisdom with us. So thank you.
Vicky Charles (01:20.364)
Aww, I'm so excited. I'll do anything to support you. You know that. this is, I'm so proud of you.
Conscious Success Co (01:24.92)
You're the best.
Okay, so let's go back to the very beginning. Can you tell us a little bit about what were you like as a kid and what did you dream of being when you grew up? The very, very beginning.
Vicky Charles (01:35.891)
wow. Wow. Well, I'll tell you what I didn't think I was going to go into is the world of interior design. I didn't know that existed. You know, I kind of grew up in the countryside in England, you know, kind of middle class. My dad was in the police force. My mom worked for a secretary. She went back to school when I was seven, you know, in a really kind of country, idyllic childhood where, you know, my mom would decorate and go to the
kind of local store and choose the wallpapers and we would pick one and my dad would wallpaper it and then I would move my furniture around in my bedroom and they were pretty, you know, so I had no idea this world even existed. Yeah, I studied fine art and literature and kind of always liked the creative side, was never going to do math, science, you know, and that was kind of, yeah, you just kind of, I was very, I think, relaxed, easygoing.
kid who just kind of went along with go with the flow and you kind of
Conscious Success Co (02:36.718)
So there was no grand plan. You just knew you weren't going to go into math.
Vicky Charles (02:39.712)
There still isn't Emma, there still is not a grand plan. So yeah.
Conscious Success Co (02:44.396)
And so was there any, like what was the definition of success? What did that mean to you growing up? Were there any expectations placed upon you explicitly, implicitly in terms of what you were meant to achieve with your life?
Vicky Charles (02:57.58)
Not at all. think the definition, think independently wealthy, you know, not to depend on a partner. You know, I watched my mom work, even though my parents are still married, I presume very happily. There was, you know, my mom always worked for her own money and her own financial stability. And I think that was an important, I just think work ethic, you know, it was just work really hard and be kind to people. That was kind of the mantra. So I had my first job at probably 14.
and worked every weekend. I just wanted my own money to choose my own clothes. My parents provided me with the things I needed, but my dad wasn't gonna buy me those high heels, stilettos, the white stilettos that I needed when I was 14. So it was hell no. So I had to get my own money to do that. Yeah. I'm gonna work for this. I'm gonna hide those in my school bag and wear them to school. So yeah, that was it. You know, it was always. And I worked in the catering industry.
Conscious Success Co (03:41.44)
Yeah, you're like, need those white stilettos, so I guess I'm going to work for it.
Vicky Charles (03:54.934)
from a really young age, you're in an old people's home, a nursing home, and then I worked in a pub and then a pizza restaurants. And I think that's one of the best careers to go into. You learn sales, you learn to read people, you learn kind of, you know, the hustle of hard work and every day is kind of a do-over. So you kind of, it's not like if you had a bad night, you didn't make much money, then the next night you try again and you work harder and you...
Conscious Success Co (04:16.311)
Mm-hmm.
Vicky Charles (04:22.922)
have fun with it. So I think the catering industry is such a great way to learn life skills, just human interaction, reading a room, how to upsell, that you can kind of take that into any career. So I always kind of worked some way in the catering industry through our school.
Conscious Success Co (04:28.398)
Mm-hmm.
Conscious Success Co (04:41.56)
So that was while you were in school or just after school? Mm-hmm. Wow.
Vicky Charles (04:45.452)
Yeah, I was in school, the hallway from about the age of 14, as as I could, I was working.
Conscious Success Co (04:52.462)
And so what did you talk to us about like the early years coming out of school? What did that look like? What was your career direction?
Vicky Charles (04:57.93)
I mean, schools, I think it's so hard for any college graduate, right? Regardless of which, where you grow up or where you are. You have your whole life planned with college advisors, high school advisors, people guiding you, and then you graduate and it's like, wow, now this is me. Everything's been planned until this moment. And then most people have no idea what they want to do or don't, haven't discovered it and end up moving, having to move back home.
So I moved back home for about three months and went, no, I can't, I'm suffocating in a small town and ended up moving in with a friend in Oxford and getting a job, actually it was owned by a saw house and a restaurant, waiting tables. But having no idea what you want to do, I just hadn't experienced it. And also this kind of shock of the plan, wait, I need a plan now. The plan was always just, she says, barring things over. The plan was always the plan, knocking water.
So I think it's really hard. So I was really lucky to just kind of fall into work with the right people and just get offered opportunities working for Soar House back then to kind of travel, to do the Cannes Film Festival, to go to LA for the Oscars and do all these fun things as a waitress, waiting tables.
Conscious Success Co (06:11.692)
So you were working in Oxford at one of Nick Jones, the founder of Soho House's restaurants. How did you start to develop a relationship or be seen as someone who had high potential, who is starting to be thought of for these different opportunities?
Vicky Charles (06:25.653)
I not at all in the design world. I was just great with people. And I think, I mean, it's also key to kind of what I do now. I used to just know how, I mean, terrible with food and drink. That's why I don't work in the industry, food and drink industry anymore. And don't know anything about it. I'm a vegetarian, have been for 40 years. So it's not like I'm a foodie, but I just knew how to kind of interact with our customers. And I think just worked really hard and had fun, just had a good time. So when he said, okay, we're gonna,
to a yacht in the south of France for the Cannes Film Festival. Do you want to come along and work on it for two weeks? Hell yeah. I'm 23 years old. I'm not going to say no. That's so much fun. And we don't have enough money in tips to then take the night train from Nice to Rome and take the rest of the month off and travel. I traveled a lot when I was in my 20s as well, which was also because you can. don't have any, apart from student loans, we start to chip out. There was no...
responsibility. There was no long leases. There was no rent. You know, I just kind of had a lot of fun saying yes to things.
Conscious Success Co (07:30.99)
There wasn't a grand plan. You weren't worried at that time in your early 20s about like, what's this all going to lead to or how am I going to turn this into a quote unquote real career?
Vicky Charles (07:39.465)
That's another thing. I mean, how are you meant to know you haven't done anything yet? That's another pressure I feel bad for kids just graduating. Like, what do you want to be? like, how do you know? Try everything. Travel. Work really hard. Just say yes to opportunities. Even if it's the wrong one, it will lead you to something else. Just get out there and do something would be my advice.
Conscious Success Co (07:59.544)
But I think that's so counter to a lot of like the conventional guidance that people, kids get and the pressure that they feel today, you know, coming out of high school and going to college or university. And it's like, you need to get a job in consulting or finance like right out of school and start climbing that ladder. And if you miss the boat, like you're not going to get those opportunities. So to you, it seems like, yeah, of course you should go travel and experiment and figure out what you're good at.
Vicky Charles (08:16.042)
Yeah.
Conscious Success Co (08:27.938)
But I think that for a lot of people, that's not the guidance that they grew up hearing. was that instilled in you from your parents or you just figured that out?
Vicky Charles (08:33.918)
I personally agree.
I mean, my parents were horrified that they just spent all this money on my education and I was waiting tables and then disappear for a month traveling, you know, not at all. I just was kind of, I didn't know what it was. so, but I was also working and paying for myself at the same time. So it wasn't, was sitting at home in their basement waiting for something to happen. I was meeting new and interesting people and seeing wonderful things and just saying yes to opportunities. And I think that's how you get on that path.
I think if you know you're lucky, if you have a platinum, you know you want to get into whatever finance or something, then follow that. But if you don't, it doesn't matter yet. You will find it as you go.
Conscious Success Co (09:09.516)
And so.
Conscious Success Co (09:19.529)
I mean, I certainly didn't have a plan. mean, when I worked for you, had been in the entertainment industry as an assistant, then my friend was like, hey, you want to move to New York? It's super fun here you can work as a design assistant for Vicki Charles. And I was like, yeah, that sounds fun. then, you know, move back. I was trying everything on. And so, you know, I think you really helped me to see that like, yeah, you're 22. Like that's exactly what you should be doing right now. That's not a problem.
Vicky Charles (09:23.795)
I know, Emma. I know.
Vicky Charles (09:36.68)
Exactly.
Exactly.
Vicky Charles (09:45.26)
100 % 100 % I think that's the way to do it. just you know when you are given that opportunity and we have people girls and actually guys come in our office and ask the intern because I'm not sure they want to work in interiors I might come in and just lean into it like you don't have to be know everything but just if you are here just work really hard at it and say yes and it's okay if it doesn't feel right but just doing anything half ass is just a waste of time.
Conscious Success Co (10:09.398)
and
Conscious Success Co (10:13.614)
And I think that that's good advice and like a guiding principle, as you say, like work hard and be kind to people and lean in and learn and say yes. if you do that, you're going to very quickly figure out like, this feels good. I'm interested in this. I'm good at this and double down or like that's not for me. And that's feedback.
Vicky Charles (10:21.289)
Yeah, and say yes.
Vicky Charles (10:32.459)
I also think people forgive inexperience when you're just, you know, when you're just trying, like they forgive mistakes. I see it in our office. We forget you're like, their eyes terrible or they're, they messed this up, but they're really sweet and they're trying really hard. You're like, all right, let's try again. You know, that's the whole thing.
Conscious Success Co (10:52.718)
I I remember I still have memories of you asking me to go look at vintage pieces across first dibs and other websites and pick ones for projects based on, I didn't even know, like use my eye. And I'm like, I don't have an eye? What are you talking about? How am I supposed to select ones for you to then review? And you just trusted people and you gave people a shot. And you're like, have a go, do the best that you can. And that was like for my...
inner perfectionist, probably like the exact life lesson that I needed and so fucking daunting to do again and again, but you didn't have any qualms about that at all.
Vicky Charles (11:25.043)
I remember.
Vicky Charles (11:33.557)
I mean, I think a lot of that came from Nick Jones as well. have to give him credit because he was also of that attitude. You know, like if you just work hard and you try, then it happens, you know, like it's really is. And he was very much that. I mean, I had no business running that the position I had. wasn't qualified. go for school for that. I didn't have all the technical programs, but he's the same principle, right? It's just work hard, try. Yes.
some talent hopefully along the way that gets you to where you are but it's that same like why would why not you you know and also it's not heart surgery you know no one was going to die if you picked the wrong chair let's keep it all in perspective you know
Conscious Success Co (12:14.893)
Hmm.
And those words, I remember you saying that way back then, like, this isn't heart surgery, right? Like, I remember, I think at one point we had a shipment of like 40 chairs that we needed for a club opening that was not going to make it in time. And I'm like freaking out or something. You're like, we're not, you know, we're not saving lives here, right? We're doing design. Keep that in perspective. How did you, how did you, how did you always keep that perspective even under?
Vicky Charles (12:22.612)
totally.
Vicky Charles (12:36.88)
Everything in perspective, Yeah, and balance.
Conscious Success Co (12:44.192)
a lot of stress, both at the Soho House, I imagine the stress of running projects under your own company, Charles & Co., with high profile clients. How do you keep that perspective when it's not always easy to do?
Vicky Charles (12:55.316)
I mean, it's all relationship based, right? It's all, it comes really early on with whoever you wanna work with that you have to communicate. And we say this a lot when I meet new clients. It's like, this is the honeymoon. live really, we have to really like each other on this first day and this honeymoon because anybody who's ever renovated or done anything, something goes wrong.
And I don't want it to go wrong. And my job is to come up with all the options to try and limit how it's going to go wrong, but something will and how I communicate. I hate it when people say to me, the chairs are stuck and that's period. It's like they've stopped. We can try this. can air ship them. can, but it's going to cost this. Like give me all the options. I hate no. And I think it's the same. It's just about how you communicate with people. And it's like, have I done the best I've can?
Here's all these are the options and it kind of is what it is. You can like, it's such a useless emotion to worry. No good will come of it.
Conscious Success Co (13:54.797)
Yeah, you're like, find options like A, B, and C backup, like empower me to make a choice here. And it might not be what we initially thought, but there's workarounds. And otherwise, like you can only do what you can do. And almost setting that expectation, whether with a client or any business that you do, that things are going to go sideways sometimes. That is the expectation. That's life. Even if you do your job well, that's still going to happen versus holding the expectation that nothing will go wrong.
Vicky Charles (14:00.562)
Yeah, amen. Exactly.
Vicky Charles (14:15.262)
versus life.
Vicky Charles (14:20.924)
sometimes those mistakes look sometimes those mistakes actually look better or were the right path anyway you just never know like I can't tell you the amount of times of the replacements look better than the original choices and it just it's fine like there is no like perfection is imperfect you know like that is usually what works
Conscious Success Co (14:43.384)
Yeah, you're so embodied in not leaning into perfectionism and being able to see the opportunity and how things can be even better when they don't go according to our preconceived notion of how things should be. And I think that was really one of the biggest things that I learned, just being around you and working with you. And I had to learn that lesson again and again over the next 10, 15 years and probably still learning it. But I think that of all of...
the people that I've ever worked with or been around. Like you to me are someone who just truly believes that things are going to be okay and we can learn and we can iterate and we can shift and perfect the illusion.
Vicky Charles (15:17.982)
Vicky Charles (15:23.38)
Things are, mean, sometimes, sometimes they're not and sad things and sickness and things like that, not in my work world. You know, it's just like, it's keeping things in perspective. And it just. Thanks.
Conscious Success Co (15:36.814)
So talk to us, so you were working hard, you were building relationships. How did you move from being a waitress, a server, to then getting into design at Soho House?
Vicky Charles (15:49.515)
I mean, it was really gradual and it was the right place at the right time a little bit. was from organizing, from working the food and beverage part of the event. So it was then moved into organizing them. And I think a lot of what I do now is learned from event organizing, you know, it's budgets, it's logistics and it's aesthetics at the end. And it's the same, and it was great training. And then I was just so, you know, involved in Sower House. I became to kind of really understand the aesthetic and the design.
Um, and it was just a gradual, you know, I started with, I think it was so ho beach house Miami with Martin Brudinski. did the public areas. did all the bedrooms and then, you know, so I also still hiring great designers at the time. They'll so Crawford, Martin Brudinski, Waldo. And then I got to learn watching them. And then in the end, you know, a lot of it comes down to your Rolodex in each country. And that was another great opportunity. So I was expanding to different places. got to learn.
you know, meet different people in different cities. And then it just, we just started to build something and then it became a revenue source, as you know, like other people started to ask us to design their hotels or their houses. And so I learned how to build a business, not only just do the design, it was a little bit right place at the right time with Nick and then, you know, him trusting me to kind of do that, run that part of that. I think there were 90 people in design when I left, which was 10 years ago now.
Tesso House 10 years ago.
Conscious Success Co (17:19.726)
That's amazing. you did have some people to learn from and learn under as you were getting your footing in design.
Vicky Charles (17:26.962)
absolutely. mean, each absolutely. So, know, Martin, the way he ran his office, Elsa from her whole approach and philosophy of design. And then, you know, kind of you learn on every job site, there's can't talk about the numerous architects, the new craftsman, contractors. And the kind of thing was every job should be better.
Nick was always trying to improve and that's also was really amazing to be around. It was like, how do we make this better than the last one? How do we make each bar design, each everything we do better? So you kind of learn as we went, you know, it was never looking back. It was always, and because it was in-house, you'd know about the mistakes. You maybe weren't just moving on. You'd know what would, wouldn't work. And then you'd build on that and take it to another place. I had the period of longevity in the same job for a long time.
to learn.
Conscious Success Co (18:20.75)
And in terms of like the Soho has aesthetic, is that something that you learned from Nick and the other designers and then that became your own or was that always something you gravitated towards as well? how has that kind of evolved as you've gone out on your own?
Vicky Charles (18:36.731)
even be able to just describe it. I think I was part of the team that built it. wouldn't even know. think the Sower House, the mantra was always home from home. And then we were designing, had to always, it's just still probably a mantra. You always design location specific. So like Montana House would look different to a Florida house, even if it's owned by the same person. But it's frequented by the same person.
So then you're designing to the functionality of how that person lives. And then you make it location specific to the environment. And that's still the philosophy of how you design. And something, it's always about things that look better over time, things that age well, something that feels incredibly comfortable. I always think that the spaces I hopefully designed are better in person, because it's about how they make you feel rather than how they photograph.
I noticed this feeling of being lived in and used and for people to grow, like families to grow. Like I work in the area of people's lives that are changing rather than lives that are done. You people can you hire an interior designer because there's something in your world that is changing. And so it's kind of that growth part. So you're kind of always trying to create this new experience of home and that from commercial to residential.
Conscious Success Co (19:48.302)
Mm-hmm.
Conscious Success Co (20:01.888)
And centering that experience of how you live in it and how it's actually functional and not just beautiful. There are some designers certainly that have a totally different perspective and ethos and are much more on trend or whatever that looks like. But that was not at all both Soho House and your personal aesthetic.
Vicky Charles (20:25.225)
No, it was always functionality. mean, back especially, and that's why Soar House is great training ground. think my career into interiors is quite unique in terms I came through hospitality. So mean, chairs and tables had to make money, right? First and foremost, that's the whole purpose of them being there. So the functionality of a space and they actually making it easy for servers to get to a service station, to get to a table, to the flow of service, housekeepers being able to clean a room fast enough.
the functionality of everything, then you decorate it. And it's still really applied to, know, we work really, when we have new clients, we work really long and hard on layouts and making sure every little detail from the house isn't even out of the ground. And I'm working out what they've got, keeping their bedside tables, do they need, how big they need to be, you know, to make sure the length of that bed wall fits, which affects the overall size of the house and the walls that being built. So it's kind of those micro details about how people live and use a space.
that you build around that rather than the other way around.
Conscious Success Co (21:27.938)
And I love that it's about how they're actually going to use it, how it's going to feel. so much of now when I talk about conscious success, it's success that actually feels good on the inside versus just looks good on the outside. And I think that that's very much reflected in the way that you design. It's like how a space feels to be in it, not just how it looks in a magazine.
Vicky Charles (21:48.202)
Totally, and hopefully these places, you're also building for longevity, you know, and also kind of legacy. If you're spending millions on a project, which it costs to build something, it's more than, maybe more than my lifetime. And so you're kind of like building something that's going to last generational. So you want to take the care that it will work and it functions. Cause if they change a chair in 20 years, who cares, you know, but the actual proportions and the design and the flow is all kind of something you have to think about.
as you make this, as you put something on the earth. It's kind of a responsibility to do that with that kind of money.
Conscious Success Co (22:24.814)
So staying just back to Soho House for a moment. So you learned under other people. You were bringing what you knew from hospitality and catering and the function and all of that. At what point did you take the helm and you were head of design?
Vicky Charles (22:41.085)
I mean, it was really organic in a way. was never a knit, as you know, Nick James wasn't a big fan of titles. It was kind of very organic and it was before Instagram, it was before the Pinterest interior designers. We used to get out, well, you remember, we used to go out and get inspiration from a reclaimed tile or a chair or the buildings used to give us, and So House did a lot of renovations of old buildings and that used to give us a lot of the inspiration.
of what it was. So was a much more kind of less off the screen, more physical. I used to love traveling with Nick back then and kind of all the antique markets and all the salvage. It was like a big treasure hunt. So somehow we put it all together and it was kind of like a restoration, everything. And you kind of then added the kind of velvets on top, the fabrics and the furniture. And even that was fun, like searching for the right.
Conscious Success Co (23:24.95)
It wasn't a treasure hunt.
Conscious Success Co (23:34.126)
you
Vicky Charles (23:37.833)
Velvets was very physical and going out and walking the D &D and all those designer buildings, the fabric stores. know, it's now, it's changed so much that, you know, clients want renderings and they want illustrations, but back then you used to feel it and touch it so much more.
Conscious Success Co (23:42.19)
you
Conscious Success Co (23:55.023)
And it was kind of this great unfolding, this great treasure hunt where you didn't have the master plan at the start, but you're like, okay, now I'm engaging and co-creating with the universe and what I find and what I feel and what I gravitate towards, which is such a different perspective than like I have the perfect renderings and the plan of what this is going to look like and then I'm going to find that exact thing.
Vicky Charles (24:03.879)
Yeah, totally.
Vicky Charles (24:16.7)
And it's interesting because a lot of that came from trust from Nick, because we knew each other really well by this stage. I've already worked for him for 10 years. And so it's kind of trust in that process, which is hard to do with a new client, right? They, of course they trust you in terms of like, they know you're a designer and you're at aesthetic, but to trust them with so much money and be, you know, I've always said that sometimes I say that sometimes like, I don't know yet. Like I haven't built that path yet to know what that end will be, but we will figure out and I will know just let's just.
Conscious Success Co (24:46.562)
And you'll say that to clients, I don't know yet and are comfortable saying.
Vicky Charles (24:46.792)
anyone. Yeah, yeah, because I think there's other things to decide upon, right? There's other things, the whole process, so anyone even like renovating your bathroom. There are thousands of decisions to make from what color do you want the flush on your toilet to how square rectangle tiles and tiles, no tiles, marble stone, wood floors, not you know, there are 400 how big the sink
Do we do two things? we do what bigger vanity? there is, and so my job is to start curating decisions for you before it costs you time or money. So based on my experience, I will start to go, right, this is, they need to know about the walls right now. Like, and then we can talk about the fixtures and then we can do paint colors last. Like that's the process. And by the time I get 70 % into the process of decision-making, I'll know the answer to the next question.
because it is a treasure hunt and you just have to start at the beginning and go on this journey, this ride together with decisions. And so I got to do that a lot faster. I got to do that without having to explain it so much, it's so house because that was by then it was my 15th so house design. There's a trust level there.
Conscious Success Co (25:56.047)
Right. And so you'd built that trust with Nick and then you'd built that trust just at Soho House and doing it enough times and knowing their process and how you deliver in that way.
Vicky Charles (26:10.183)
just know what to focus on first. You know, like you can't know everything at the end. And that's slightly the problem now with design, you know, when you do marketing renderings and people want it designed, you have to choose the lampshade before the walls have come up through the ground. So it's just a different
Conscious Success Co (26:15.202)
Mm-hmm.
Conscious Success Co (26:23.438)
Great.
And do you do that today? Do you do those renderings and choose that? Or do you push back and say, that's not how I designed, that's not my process?
Vicky Charles (26:30.64)
I I would love not to do all of it, but you have to do some of it, especially for commercial projects where you're doing, you're selling these apartments off the end design. Yeah, we do it, but it would still allow people to change their mind. You know, until it costs time or money. That's the goal is not to make the final decision until you're, until you, if you delay it, costs money.
Conscious Success Co (26:36.418)
Yeah.
Conscious Success Co (26:45.953)
Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.
Conscious Success Co (26:56.766)
Mm-hmm. Yeah, and I want to come back to that, like that time and money focus. But I'm curious also, because you became a mother while at Soho House, right? So you have two kids. And when I was working for you, two young kids. And you're also two babies having to travel a lot, go all over the world for these installs. And I imagine that's continued through Charles and Co. today. How did you
Vicky Charles (27:09.192)
Two babies.
Conscious Success Co (27:23.202)
balance, how did you think about navigating both when the jobs that you've had have been demanding and high travel and when your kids came into the picture, did that shift things for you at all?
Vicky Charles (27:34.864)
I mean, I think it's really hard for women for me, from my experience. You work was what I knew how to do. Work was the easy place and being a mom was really hard. It was something I'd know, especially when they were first babies. Like I just you have no, I had no idea what I was doing. I had no idea as a control freak either, because I thought I was the most relaxed person until I lost control. Right. I mean, taking me.
Conscious Success Co (27:57.443)
Really, I don't think you look as a control freak at all.
Vicky Charles (28:00.583)
I mean, I like to control my day and my schedule and my timing. And I know what I'm doing when until you have a baby. And then you're like, we don't know how long that time is going to be today, or if there even will be one. So work was always the easy place. I mean, I was really lucky that my mum was able to come and stay for long periods of time when I took trips to help me, you know, and my kids have benefited from a really close relationship with their grandparents. I also had a phenomenal nanny. probably remember her, Petra.
Conscious Success Co (28:29.39)
Hmm. That's right.
Vicky Charles (28:29.928)
who still has a phenomenally close relationship with my kids. So I think the whole phrase of it takes a village and building other women around you to help you to kind of, you know, women helping women, just always. Like, and I always respected Petra as another working mom in her time. So, you know, it's hard. And I would say
Even I think the roles or at least I run a company now where I'm like families first. And if you have to finish it at three 30 to pick up your daughter from school, but you're back on email at five 30 work, what works for you? Like there is no black, especially since COVID, you know, and we run a very hybrid system of office and home depending on where's the best environment for you to work. And I'm really lucky with my team. Like everyone's incredibly talented and passionate about what they do. So I don't have to micromanage.
Where are you on a Thursday? They're always in the right place on a Thursday where that needs to be in the office or at home. So I would say it's hard. I would get help and I would also just do what works for your family and don't kill yourself. Like I don't think I didn't prioritize enough sleep back then. I think there are times now where there was a period when my kids are probably
10 to 12 or 7, 8 to 12, that kind of pre-teen when they want to be with you all the time and they don't understand where you're traveling, whereas babies don't really understand it. You know, so my daughter, especially, actually, I have my son, they both came on trips with me. My daughter will never go to an antique fair again. She's bored out of her mind. Scared them straight out of the industry. So I would take them with me a lot on travels.
Yeah, and I think just the support, you know, my husband supports the family business and you just can't do everything.
Conscious Success Co (30:27.022)
I remember, and correct me if I'm misquoting you, but I remember you saying to me, because I asked you, I thought you were such a great mother, and I asked you, what is the key to how you parent so well? And I think you said something like, at the end of the day, it's just about consistency and love. If they know you're going to show up consistently and they feel your love, everything else will sort itself out.
Vicky Charles (30:39.153)
Thank you.
Conscious Success Co (30:53.582)
totally pretzel ourselves feeling like bad moms for so many things, but really like those are the two core things. Is that true? Do you still believe that?
Vicky Charles (30:59.399)
100%. I still feel like that one. was always a Nick was always really great. And I'm still always there to try and be there at five o'clock, like from five to seven, especially in their little I would not work be there like when Petra left and I would always do bedtime above when I wasn't traveling. And then kind of yeah, that consistency of just there is a routine and we all follow it. And that's there. And yeah, and just, I mean,
And it changes, right? Just when you figure you've got it nailed. That's the thing with having kids that the age, I mean, now I my son is 16 and just go ahead, like drivers permit and my daughter's, you know, 14 is a completely different style of parenting. You know, I go to bed before them now because I need more sleep. I could have been a nine and they are still up. So yeah, I think that it's true. I think you just do your best and you can't be perfect. Just be considered. Yeah.
I don't, yeah.
Conscious Success Co (31:57.103)
And so, know, things change, seasons change, and you also, you know, decided at some point to leave Soho House where you had, you know, built an amazing, what was it, 20-year career there and to go out on your own. Can you talk to us about when you first started feeling that, like, whisper or desire that you were ready to move on and what did that process look like for you to ultimately then make that choice?
Vicky Charles (32:21.755)
I mean, it was very long and painful. It was probably a year of actually deciding to leave and it wasn't, I mean, here's the thing. I think all those things you worry about starting your own business, none of those will be the thing that trips you up because you can, it's the stuff you don't see coming. So you can spend your time worrying about, and all the things I thought would be really hard, like registering the company and designing a website and taxes and how do I pay that? That's...
Just you find the best person to do that and it gets done. It's never that stuff, you know? So all those things I was scared about doing. I mean, for me, it was time. mean, obviously, Nick has family and all those people I worked with. It was just, I think it was something about like, how did I want to spend the next 20 years of my life? It was kind of a now or never moment that did that. And...
Just having more control over my schedule, my time, the people I wanted to work with. That was a big driving factor of it. It was never really about the money side of it. It was more control creatively. yeah, I mean, and I think you have to be do it slightly naively, otherwise you would never do it. Cause it's scary. Like it's just all those things, but yeah, all the things I worried about weren't the problems and all the things.
Conscious Success Co (33:34.062)
Totally.
Vicky Charles (33:41.669)
I thought I should have worried about. I would have no idea. know, sort of the naivety of doing it.
Conscious Success Co (33:45.864)
What were the things you should have worried about that you didn't at the time that then tripped you up?
Vicky Charles (33:51.048)
I mean, just the too much business and no business that same fear in one day, I think anyone who has their own business knows that fear of waking up in a panic. I have so much to do today and then kind of going to bed with like, oh my God, we don't the phone hasn't rang. I haven't got any more business. It's like, that is the and it never goes away. I just think I've had the company now 10 years, I think you just get more comfortable with that feeling that it's going to be all right. And
Conscious Success Co (34:05.648)
It's so true.
Conscious Success Co (34:19.342)
Mm-hmm.
Vicky Charles (34:20.409)
you know, and who knows if we still have business in three months, the whole world could shut down again and it go wrong and or I've said yes to many things and we're never going to meet these deadlines. It kind of always works itself out. And that's just where you have to get comfortable with.
Conscious Success Co (34:35.15)
And is that the mindset you just choose to focus on? Like it'll work itself out and to trust that or is there something that you, some action you take?
Vicky Charles (34:43.207)
I I write lists, that's how I make it. This is brain dumping. I write lists of just everything I need to do to keep the plate spinning every morning and every evening. I write a new list of just the nonsense that I never seem to get a list short, but that kind of manages the worry list about what can I push for another week? What has to be done tomorrow? And some of the things on the list be like,
poke this person about a new business, poke this person, you know, just actually saying it and putting it on paper helps my, calms my panic, you know, of the no work too much work.
Conscious Success Co (35:22.092)
And you accept that you're never going to get through the whole list and that that's okay. You just have to figure out what needs to be done today.
Vicky Charles (35:26.501)
I think I would, I would be panicked if I did get through the list. mean, I'd be, then I'd be bored and I'm done. There's nothing else to do, you know, that'd be like time to shut the company. I finished my list. We're done. Close the book. Last page. That's just, that would be awful.
Conscious Success Co (35:41.855)
Yeah. Well, I feel like so many of my clients will… Something we talk about and work through is that they're working from this to-do list and always making themselves wrong for never crossing everything off and getting to inbox zero. Then that's this constant stress where you're like, I'm behind, I'm not doing enough because I never get to the bottom of my list versus looking at it from I will never get to the bottom of my list as long as I'm in business.
And that's okay, but am I focused on the right things today? And am I actually pulling to the top what actually needs to be done versus just trying to cross everything off?
Vicky Charles (36:12.571)
That's it.
Vicky Charles (36:17.767)
I I start down the side of my list of things that have to be done today. And if I can cross down those and there's a usually like three things, if I can cross those three things off, it's been a good day. You know, that's the goal. It's just.
Conscious Success Co (36:29.036)
and you let yourself feel that it's been a good day for crossing those three things.
Vicky Charles (36:31.847)
Yeah, I got those three things that done on that list because the list is like my memory. The list is things that I don't want to call Eric today. I need to call him on Friday, but it's on my list, you know, it would just all Thursday unless he calls me first, you know, it's just it's ticking away. It's like the ticking over list. Things that you had to done and they will at some point come off there because by Friday, Eric needs to be called so that will be off the list, you know.
Conscious Success Co (36:50.549)
Mm-hmm.
Conscious Success Co (36:58.798)
So when you founded and established Charles & Co., you did so with a partner, Julia Corden. How did that, how did she come into the picture and how did you, what did the process look like once you made the choice to leave to set yourself up for success? Was there like a lot done on Charles & Co. while you were still at Soho House or did you fully leave Soho House and then just like take a gap and figure it out? Can you talk to us about that?
Vicky Charles (37:07.974)
Yep.
Vicky Charles (37:24.807)
But yes.
Vicky Charles (37:28.345)
I left him kind of immediately. mean, so Jules, what was great about having a partner like Jules and still is, is that she's not a designer and doesn't want to be an interior designer. So we have very different roles. I think it's harder when you both do the same job and that gets very, just tricky in the beginning. I mean, maybe, I don't know. My experience is it was really good to have somebody who doesn't do it. And she was just more like an incredible cheerleader, supporter, agent, manager for me at the time.
you know, who just would helping establish the company press wise to be a sounding board on anything that was unrelated to the actual, the design work I knew how to do. So that was almost the easy bit because I knew how to design. And actually it was so much easier not doing it for Sower House. It was suddenly really freeing. I couldn't invent another Sower House. And so the client relationship and design work was really easy. It was just everything else. And so having a partner that, you know, should we like,
I don't even know, should we be doing this thing for Goop? Should we do this thing with AD? Should we do this? She was kind of great at looking everything in the world outside of Soho, in the world outside design. And that's still very much our relationship now. So I still run Charles & Co. I still have the client facing. I still do all the design work. And Jules is in the background for any other kind of opportunities that come along and we talk about and stuff. So it was a much easier relationship to find because it was clear roles.
Conscious Success Co (38:54.318)
And I think that is so important. mean, there was a brief period in my business where I tried to have a partner and I think we had the same zones of genius, the same skill set. And ultimately, it didn't feel as supportive or an exhale to be like, I can actually offload this and this is what someone else wants to do and does well. Both of us had things that we didn't necessarily do well, but the business had to get done. It sounds like you and Julia found a very natural and supportive divide in that.
I think thinking about partnership, whether it's partnership in business or in marriage, I mean, I have a very different skill set than my husband and that works really well at home as well.
Vicky Charles (39:28.582)
100 % it's so interesting you're right and in your marriage it's easier to find the yang to your yang, like the different balance, you know, you and you settle and you maybe you attract or you fall in love with somebody who's kind of your opposite because you want that ideal but it and I think the same should be held in business. You know, then it's like or what happens is you tend to manage that other person whoever's slightly better at that one thing and that's not a great dynamic.
Conscious Success Co (39:57.103)
Totally. So did you have clients like right away or how did you set yourself up to make that leap?
Vicky Charles (39:58.489)
It's tricky.
Vicky Charles (40:05.223)
I had one, I mean, it's really easy because I wasn't needing to buy anything. I'm a service industry. So I just needed my kitchen table. It wasn't like I needed an office immediately and I didn't need any buy any products. So, you know, you just start with one client really quietly and you work from the kitchen. And then eventually you get a small office. The office was the size of a closet. And then you get one hire, which was finance, cause I hate doing money. And I knew it was really important to track it and keep all my books.
super organized, so we're really, really organized. Yeah, so it just, took a minute to get organized.
Conscious Success Co (40:42.35)
Did that feel tough at all to walk away from a stable salary to do something on your own, like having kids and New York life and all of that? It's expensive. Was that hard?
Vicky Charles (40:56.345)
100%. Yeah, 100%. I mean, you have to do that with the support of your family, know, Joe, my husband. Yeah, really. But it also was my motivation to, you know, that was the thing that like, could not have it work because I had kids and I had, you know, commit financial commitments in New York. And so that also was the, you know, and that's why I took work in the beginning that I probably wouldn't I would definitely not take now you do what you hustle.
you do what you do, you know, to make that and then that.
Conscious Success Co (41:26.156)
you earn the right to have more choice in who you work with over time. Yeah.
Vicky Charles (41:30.096)
Exactly, exactly. But I think you can't do that at the beginning if you need to get paid and you learn from those mistakes and the wrong clients and things like that as you go, well, you know.
Conscious Success Co (41:41.454)
I do. Did you have a vision for Charles & Co. when you first started that was like a mission statement or what you wanted to achieve with it or were you just like, I'm ready to have my own thing and have more flexibility and I'm going to figure it out as I go?
Vicky Charles (41:43.11)
Thank
Vicky Charles (41:57.327)
just knew that I didn't want to be constantly compared to Sower House and I didn't want it to be Sower House. I knew more what I didn't want. I wanted the work to speak for itself. So I was just trying to be kind of press shy. didn't, I wish I am quite anyway. I didn't want to do any more hospitality. So anyone in Corden said I want, so I love what you did Sower House, can you do this for me? I wouldn't do any hospitality projects because...
I was moving on from that and if you wanted that you should call Sowerhouse, you know, they still have the design board department. Yeah, didn't, I just, I was just so head down on doing the work. I didn't really think about anything else.
Conscious Success Co (42:43.382)
And so how did you start to get clients or build a reputation for yourself? I mean, you work with like super A-list clients. I'm sure not 100%, but that's a lot of your client list. And so how did you become like the go-to or the trusted person when you ventured out on your own to do that type of work?
Vicky Charles (43:01.126)
Well, I was lucky that two of them, two of the most high profile came to me when I was still at Sower House, because they'd stayed in Sower House projects and one of them, so that's kind of that introduction. And then it's the same as it is now, it's word of mouth, so recommendations, 90 % of our business is recommendations from other friends of friends. And the other thing is that we wouldn't gossip, you know, I work in people's private lives, and so.
It's very different to their public life. So even though they're incredibly famous, it's like I'm talking, I work with their family and in the space where they're not famous. we just, you know, maintaining that level of privacy and trust is kind of integral to the building, to the, to the relationship and the next job. And, know, most of, I'm really lucky that most of those clients are repeat clients, you know, most of our Rolodex is because you just get a rapport with people and it should be fun.
And it's about trust, know, because every family has, you know, stuff and everybody's just trying to spend more time with their kids and be closer as a relationship and everybody's kids, there's something, you know, so you kind of just see that and it becomes very normal relationships.
Conscious Success Co (43:59.918)
than me.
Conscious Success Co (44:17.358)
And yeah, and it's going back to what you said at the beginning, like work hard and build great relationships. Like, you know, be someone that people trust and like to be around and to see that that's served you throughout your career, even with like the most high list well-known celebrities in the world, it comes back to those same principles.
Vicky Charles (44:38.489)
same principles is about relationships and also just it should be fun as well. Like there should be some joy in what you do. And I think people could tell that, you know, like it should be, I work in a really like building something. It's really exciting and privileged. And so, you know, that's where you feel lucky to do it.
Conscious Success Co (44:43.561)
Mm-hmm.
Conscious Success Co (44:58.348)
And you have a way of seeing that, like, this can be fun, this is exciting, I'm privileged, find the humor in it versus lean into the stress. And I think that's like a mindset perspective. That's how you choose the lens you choose to see the world through. mean, delivering homes and projects for these clients, some people might see that as like super high pressure and super high stress and everything could be really.
challenging through that lens, but you're like, this gets to be fun. This gets to be joyful. And then that makes people want to work with you even more.
Vicky Charles (45:31.289)
I think so, thank you. But I also think it's about this, there's boundaries with it too. You you have to, if you work with people who have a lot of stress in their lives, there's usually nothing related to you. I think that's the other thing. If somebody's rude or not responsive, it's, you don't know what else is going in. Our natural position is to think that it's something to do with us and they don't like us anymore or that meeting went really badly because...
it can have 400 reasons and probably 90 % of them are nothing to do with you. So I think that kind of that boundary that you have to put around yourself and protect yourself. This is my work and I work Monday to Friday and of course occasionally you may see him on a Saturday or a response to something if it's really important. But there is a there is a relationship boundary in all of this that allows you to find your inner you're not dragged into things that have nothing to do with you.
I think that's also a really important part of trust.
Conscious Success Co (46:29.644)
And so do you just establish that from the beginning with working with your clients where you're just not responding on those hours?
Vicky Charles (46:37.061)
I would never say I wouldn't respond. I'm just very respectful in that relationship. Like the same respect that I show them. Like I'm not going to say, can you autograph or can you photograph? Like it's a respectful, professional relationship. And I don't think you even need to say it. Just be, you behave in that professional way and people meet you there.
Conscious Success Co (46:59.246)
And, know, what you're saying about not internalizing or centering yourself and expecting that it's about you if they're short or dismissive or don't respond, are there ever any times where then you do need to name it and ask more questions to see if there is something underlying that's not being addressed in the relationship or you're just…
Vicky Charles (47:19.941)
I think it comes out like aesthetically if you're not quite there and there are clients you know that we've I mean, because of our experience that especially in the beginning there were a few clients that I was like, we just aren't but I should probably never worked with them in the beginning, you know? Yeah, yeah, but you but there's also part of the hustle of when you start and you're taking the money and it's a good project where you're like, this is not the right
Conscious Success Co (47:38.146)
Did you know that, like deep down that you shouldn't?
Vicky Charles (47:50.015)
one for me that you you learn that with or you get more comfortable with that you know another job will come so you don't need to say yes to that one. That's also, I've never had to ask because it's usually none of my business you know like wait I think patience is also a really good value like I'm here when you're ready like that's usually my line like whenever you want to talk about this I'm here when you're ready like you let me know.
Conscious Success Co (48:17.9)
And so, you you have offices in New York, London, Italy. You travel a lot. How many days a year would you say you're on the road?
Vicky Charles (48:29.445)
Probably one week a month. I'm actually on lock. But it fluctuates. December was a lot. January, I have an allergy to traveling right now. I just want to stay home. It's cold. Nobody wants to go outside. And it varies per project. I'm thinking I'm really efficient with my travel. And obviously, I'm in a different phase of my life when my kids are a bit, just up until this age, my son's just gone to boarding school. So my weekdays are freer to travel and not come home.
Conscious Success Co (48:31.182)
I'm not
Vicky Charles (48:55.831)
early but when I was when they were younger you know I'd always try and be home by Thursday night to be back for the weekend and never leave on a Monday always Tuesday Wednesday Thursday like that same consistency and then you're just exhausted you sacrifice sleep you take those night flights all the time and now they're older I'm older can't do as many night flights so you yeah I don't I travel as need be I like the kids will come to Italy now in the summer and we'll do some work and then they
come to London, they always want to go to London and it cost me a fortune. So it varies, but you know, I do travel, but less.
Conscious Success Co (49:34.808)
Have you ever dealt with a period of burnout or low motivation over the course of your career? And if so, how did you move through that?
Vicky Charles (49:44.045)
I think it's really, especially if you're a creative, you have to be really protective of your energy. Cause that and burnout, like I, I put so much value on sleep now. My husband will complain about it. Like I am that crazy person who wears an aura ring and tries to get 95 % every night. Like I am, yeah, I'm a 95 % like a, I go to bed at nine o'clock. just, but you know, it's minimizing the noise. I think that's what hard like getting stuck on Instagram and Scott like.
Conscious Success Co (50:03.032)
thing.
Vicky Charles (50:13.411)
the worst, like even TV, just, I have to prioritize sleep for burnout. You know, I'm lucky I live in the country now, just doing less when you're burning out. I feel like rather than feeling you should do more is probably the only way I can kind of protect. think protecting your health and that takes experience and time. That's a recent thing.
Conscious Success Co (50:34.956)
And so will you let yourself just like take on less projects or put less on your to-do list or how do you actually do less?
Vicky Charles (50:42.072)
Well, I think my team have not been with me for most of them for 10 years too. Like I am really lucky for the talented people that work with me. And I'm just, you have to just can't micromanage everything. I'm like, you do it. Like I'm here when you need help. Like I'm really lucky. And I think that's a part of the business being older. It's just less.
Conscious Success Co (51:00.878)
So you're 10 years into the business. How big is the business now? How many team members do you have? 22.
Vicky Charles (51:06.2)
There's 22 and most of us have been with me for over six, seven years. So I'm really lucky that my team's really good and I always hire people better than yourself. That's my main advice. Like they're all really strong.
Conscious Success Co (51:17.25)
Wow.
Conscious Success Co (51:22.574)
Totally. And do you find, or like as you've scaled and built the business up to 22 people, are you doing a lot of that people management or do you still get to focus on the design and the things that you've always done or gravitated towards that you've really loved? Because I know for some people that when they move into having people under them, they're not doing the things that they wish they could be doing. How do you manage that?
Vicky Charles (51:45.7)
I mean, that's, that was one of the reasons why I left Sowerhouse. I wasn't designing as much, 90 people, you're not doing the design anymore. It's about money, men and finance. was a period when Sowerhouse was changing. I mean, I definitely start every involved with every concept. So every new project, I'll meet every new client and I'm also involved with every new concept. might not do, I might, some of them I do, some of them Katie, our creative director does and I'll weigh in. Like you need two people to.
bounce off or another senior designer will do it and we go back and forth. But I'm involved in always the concept. And then there's usually much better people on the team to execute. And then I'll come in and out of meetings with key, with it during, for key decision making with clients. So like I won't do every meeting, but if it's like, we're picking all the finishes, then I'll be there for that one or, you know, and then after that, like it depends on the clients. So some of they have a better rapport with better team members and they don't need to work with me.
So yeah, I'm really with my team. I really do believe in growth. They're not gonna stay. I can't have all these talented people stay and wanna work with me if they aren't feeling like they're growing. So it's...
Conscious Success Co (52:56.566)
So how do you do that? How do you keep people feeling like they're growing, especially if you don't have necessarily new positions to promote them into like having people stay with you for six, seven more years? That's a real testament to the company you've built and the culture and the leadership. So tell us about how you do that well.
Vicky Charles (53:14.67)
I mean, think it's like looking at the projects we get, like, luckily that's growth path is the kind of work we get, not just the team, know, and managing new team members, taking on bigger, more complicated projects, more exciting. You know, a lot of our job, my job is to find new work that's creatively challenging with great clients and hopefully pays well, you the unicorn. You want at least two of those minimum, you know?
Conscious Success Co (53:43.671)
How do you find those? Like, what does that look like when you're, you know, trying to bring those uniforms on?
Vicky Charles (53:47.332)
I mean, they tend to come to, first all, you make sure the last job is really great and you don't deliver anything to a client that isn't phenomenal because that client is your reference for the next job. So client's recommendations are everything. So a lot of it is just head down on the current work. then, I am really lucky to have somebody who runs my office of a new business and she was a friend for.
25 years before she worked with me and so she knows me really well and she's great at just sorting out the right kind of projects and interviewing clients and protecting the team as well, not have everybody burn out and making sure that you know the same level respect that we plan to give a client is going to be given back.
Conscious Success Co (54:37.366)
And if you're spending time in places that you're not enjoying it, do you think about like, okay, how do I shift this? How do I hire for this? How do I remove myself more from it? Is that something that you're intentionally consciously thinking about?
Vicky Charles (54:51.94)
I am very intentional when I have, if there's somebody I am about to hire, I've just hired or a project I've just started that I don't like, I have to lean very intentionally, lean so close into it and spend more time with that person and more time on that project or more time in it to really identify what it is and if it's just me.
Because the easiest thing to do when you're uncomfortable, don't like something is back away, especially if there's a new team member and you're like, they've been hired to assist this person. And I don't getting on with them that well. The worst thing to do is to then just back off. I am up in your business if I think we don't get on because they just. Yeah. And yeah, maybe. Yeah, or it was the right hire and I'm just being a tricky old cow.
Conscious Success Co (55:34.894)
until you understand what it is? Like is it sometimes just like, this was the wrong hire?
Conscious Success Co (55:44.622)
in
Vicky Charles (55:44.674)
which sometimes happens, you know, like I just need to get to know you better. And some people aren't, they may just be shy or they just insecure or they don't know how to communicate or they just really great at this aspect of drawing. And I know nothing about that, but I really appreciate their skillset. Now I understand it.
Conscious Success Co (56:03.054)
So by leaning in, you're able to better understanding it, clarity as to like, what are the gifts and talents that they do have or how can you better manage them or, you know, is the problem.
Vicky Charles (56:08.357)
what? Yeah.
Vicky Charles (56:13.88)
what is it about this project, know, and then ultimately if it is the wrong project, I've done enough due diligence by getting to know, I've tried, like I have to give it my best shot before I can walk away from it, because I've walked away from things, frustration that wasn't the right. I mean, we learn, right? As you get older.
Conscious Success Co (56:30.358)
And, but not all of us do. Like I think a lot of us lean out of discomfort and lean out of tricky relationships, but it sounds like because you lean in, you are actually learning. You are actually being like, okay, what is here for me to see and take forward? And even if this wasn't, this project wasn't totally aligned, now I know for the next time. And that's this like growth mindset and iteration. And if you keep leaning into that, you're gonna keep learning the lessons and moving ahead.
Vicky Charles (56:56.321)
I hope so. I hope so. Because I think if you don't, it's actually worse. The other option of not and just staying stagnant and who you are and not growing and not then that's actually a worse option than the one before, you know.
Conscious Success Co (57:12.856)
What is your internal voice and internal dialogue sound like? Is it that really like,
Vicky Charles (57:17.769)
not to be trusted at all.
Conscious Success Co (57:22.606)
Like, it always positive? And is it always just like, what's the lesson here? Or do you struggle with that?
Vicky Charles (57:29.763)
I what is it was present is it a charcoal? Yeah, I also I think it's more I have to give it time. Like I won't make it I sleep on it is the best advice ever. You know, just that voice that's telling you one thing on a Thursday night, even if you have to drop that email and then don't action anything. So and usually actually was my dad's advice was like, don't know what to You do nothing like just give yourself more time to think about something.
That's that's such a luxury. mean, that time is the biggest luxury, right, for everything. But the luxury to think and actually being more conscious about that thinking time. There's so many things. That's most of my list is like, need to respond to that stone. I'm like, I don't know yet. I just don't know. But I will. I got that. That I think was my inner voice. Not trusting my first instinct for sure.
Conscious Success Co (58:16.814)
And I think, yeah, I mean, right, not just being reactive, but like responding when you're ready to respond. And I think in the language I often use in coaching about like nervous system regulation, are you in fight or flight, or are you actually regulated and clear headed enough to make a good choice? Like oftentimes when we have that,
knee-jerk reaction, it's the wrong one. It's coming from fear. It's coming from scarcity. It's coming from reactivity. so trusting that, not everything is the wrong place. So being able to give yourself that time to re-regulate and get back to clarity before you act rather than just feeling that urgency or reactivity is such a key.
Vicky Charles (58:43.381)
It always.
Vicky Charles (58:47.767)
Or it's coming from like flattery or it's like this is not a pure yeah that's that's my thing.
Vicky Charles (59:02.243)
100%. That's the only thing is that you don't trust that inner voice immediately. know, like, yeah, you can recognize it and say, okay, I see you, sit over there for a bit and then I'll come back to it.
Conscious Success Co (59:14.766)
We'll chat in a bit.
Vicky Charles (59:18.047)
Yeah, I'm like, I don't know yet. Yeah, for sure. And it can be the other way. It can be I really like this person. I think we should work together and everyone on my team is going, I don't think so. You know, I always get my team involved with a new client and they're like, I don't get it. I'm like, okay, let's just all nobody make a decision yet. Let's all sit with this a bit longer, you know, and then talk it out. I think having trusted people to run out.
Conscious Success Co (59:21.134)
Okay.
Conscious Success Co (59:34.818)
Mm-hmm.
Conscious Success Co (59:39.011)
Okay, I'm selfishly going to ask you questions about like renovations and, you know, home design process because we are… I'm not at the pictures yet, but like talk to me about what are the most common mistakes that you see people make when approaching a renovation or a gut and like trying to make their home into what they want it. What are the pitfalls?
Vicky Charles (59:47.843)
Show me the pictures, what colours are we doing?
Vicky Charles (01:00:07.46)
Puppying something from Instagram immediately. actually ignore all colors, finishes, textures. Think about why you're doing this. What isn't working that you need to change it? Like functionality first. Like does it fit all your shoes if you're making a bigger mudroom? Does it like, do you have root down off counter services for your coffee machine and your kettle? And like why are we even here? Then worry about wallpaper paint color.
And I, you know, and, just good design is a cliche, but it's about balance, right? There's not too much of one thing. So if you're going to do big and bold, then you need to scale something calm with it, like to let the star shine, let there be one star on the stage and a lot of supporting acts doing too much or one thing is also a big mistake.
Conscious Success Co (01:00:50.189)
Hmm.
Conscious Success Co (01:00:56.174)
Mmm.
Conscious Success Co (01:01:00.022)
And so right now we're speaking to an architect, but we don't have a designer. Can you talk to us a little bit about like the difference between what architects do and what designers do? And why do you think that including a designer is so important versus just working with an architect?
Vicky Charles (01:01:15.459)
It's such a good question, Such a good question. Okay, so an architect is gonna look at your project in a very different lens than an interior designer is. And of course there are crossovers and of course there are architects who are incredibly good at interiors, but the more eyes on your project to balance everything out is just gonna be better, right? Especially experienced eyes. you can, know, in most jobs,
Have a clear matrix at the start of it like saying what I'm responsible for and what you're paying me for and what an architect is paying being paid for and where we cross over so it'll be like, you know, I'm in charge of the furniture and the furniture layouts, but the architect will check that those all those things fit. He's in charge of the overall plans, but I will check that my furniture, you know, so you're getting a double set of eyes on everything to make sure everything is coordinated and the way you want to live.
You know, you're the interior designer is with you till the final picture frame is installed. Right. And then the architect is with you while you're planning the space, the, what can be permitted. What's the, so you're hiring two people at very different stages from the beginning to the end. So having one that stops too early and having one that starts too late is where you get the pit holes of things that fall apart.
Conscious Success Co (01:02:37.752)
So when's the ideal time to bring in a designer in a project?
Vicky Charles (01:02:40.864)
At the same time, at the same time, right at the beginning, right at the beginning, even if we have nothing to do for a couple of months and that's okay and that was reflected in the fees, we're still looking, I'm asking you questions. Like I was just talking about your bed wall. Does it fit the size of the bedside tables? Does your husband have a pile of books like mine does and needs a library next to his bed? know, what size is your mattress?
Do you want medicine cabinets? you, know, like your kids' bedrooms, that may be too far for babies. Toy storage, you know, let's future-proof it. Let's think about this house in 10 years' time. I'm asking the micro-detail questions that are going to affect the layout of your home. While the architect is musing, thinking about proportions and buildings and the volumes of the spaces.
I'm looking at it for completely different lanes at the same time. You know, when we work it, like we work more intensely towards the end, they're more intense at the beginning, but the really best projects are when we start and we have respect for each other's skill set as you go through it.
Conscious Success Co (01:03:42.946)
And it sounds like you're having that lens at the questions that you're asking of like that day to day living and the functionality that the architect might not be thinking at that level.
Vicky Charles (01:03:51.746)
Yeah, and I'm sure they are, but they're not going to get involved with the actual finishing that up of making the beds and, you know, just dumb stuff like, you know, when you do bunk beds, like how do you actually get the sheets on them at the end? You know, when you're trying to flannel all those things, the livability of it is really what the interior designer does. And, you know, you're also hiring somebody for a wealth of more finishes, a wealth of more textures, a wealth of more, like you're opening up all your options so much more to be the what ifs, you know.
I've probably designed over 300 bedrooms. And so the experience that comes with that, you're like, okay, your lighting layouts, are multiple, you know, there are 4,000 million options for everything on during this process. And so you're hiring somebody else to help curate who's listening to you from day one on how you live. Also looking at what you, you know, a lot of our first questions are why are we here? Like what's wrong with your current house? Maybe you've relocated, but we loved our old house and then we'll talk about what you loved about it.
Conscious Success Co (01:04:21.966)
Mm-hmm.
Conscious Success Co (01:04:40.75)
Mm-hmm.
Vicky Charles (01:04:51.996)
or we outgrew it so you need more space. Like we're doing that interview in such a different way than an architect is because they have different responsibilities. They're looking at what they can build and what will be permitted and what will be allowed. Whereas we're kind of like much more the dream big at the beginning with less restrictions.
Conscious Success Co (01:05:10.358)
And do all designers work that way or what should people consider when looking to hire a designer to assess whether that's the right fit or partnership?
Vicky Charles (01:05:19.042)
I think it depends on your project. If you're looking more of a decorating job, some designers just do that. We only work on gut renovations or new builds because that's more of my skill set. It's the longevity of those bigger projects. So I think it really depends on your... And there's a huge amount of logistics that go into...
interior design. It's not just the and ultimately, I always say to the junior designers office, like the clients are creative, like they're the muse, let them pick and then I'm next in line and then the senior designer. you know, like that's like I'm curating even the 400 chairs out there to pick three for you to try and then they may all be around there. Find the next three. It's like someone doing all the legwork for you.
Conscious Success Co (01:06:01.647)
And that's bringing it back to that time and money, right? Like you are saving them time and yes, they are paying money, but what is their time worth and to have the wealth of knowledge and perspective and to make so many of those decisions to only surface a few choices and then go back if more choices need to be surfaced versus having all of that.
Vicky Charles (01:06:05.09)
I'm learning.
Vicky Charles (01:06:17.813)
And also working within your budget as well. You know, if you're saying, I only want to spend a thousand dollars on a dining chair or 500, you know, that's, could take you a really long time to find those chairs. Whereas we have more resources just being, turning it longer.
Conscious Success Co (01:06:33.848)
Mm-hmm. So for someone out there, you know, I can think of at least one client, I'm sure more if I thought about it, top of my mind, that they're stuck in a tech job that feels uncreative. They don't actually like what they do. And when I ask about, OK, if you could do anything in the world, like, secretly, what would that be, wanting to do something more creative like interior design? So what would you tell someone like that who's mid-career, who feels they've gone down the wrong path and maybe it's too late for them?
What advice would you give if they know that that's calling to them?
Vicky Charles (01:07:06.818)
Well, I feel like they need to think about whether it's interior design. Do they love doing their own house? Which in, in to be an interior designer, you're, really in the people business. You know, my ego, my taste is a very small part of that process. You know, doing my own house is very different to doing somebody else's house. So if you love the process of doing, which is fine. If that's what you love, then just stick to that one style.
and show that too. But if it's really that you enjoy being around people and being challenged by different people's aesthetics and that you should go into that industry if it's just, and then there's so many different aspects of it. have a same question was asked recently to a friend and she has taken just found a niche in the market to do teenage girls rooms, like start small. Like just like girls who like, you know, there's families in Connecticut where she lives and.
So she just got hired to renovate some daughter's room on a budget. So you start and then you start that word of mouth. You you could just do the styling. lot of people move in and hate their bookcases. You could do that. Or if you really want to get in the industry for a part of the career, I would definitely learn some of the technical skills that you need to some of the computer programs because you'll need that to go into work with Interior Design Studio and then offer to intern if you can afford to because then you're in the materials library learning and just surround it.
Conscious Success Co (01:08:28.152)
Yeah, get close to it and also figure out what is it that you really love about it.
Vicky Charles (01:08:32.406)
Really want to do. Yeah, it could be just that I love the styling part or I love I could just help somebody decorate it because there's so many, you know, where I'm at one end of the business, but there's the other end is just somebody wants help choosing dining chairs offer that on Craigslist. Like, I don't know, you can do you don't have to go in all full. You can just start small and it just takes one client. And then you start in this word of mouth.
Conscious Success Co (01:08:57.322)
I love it. Looking back over the course of your career, was there a particular stage that you enjoyed the most or chapter in the business? When you look back, is there something that stands out to you as like, those were the golden days?
Vicky Charles (01:09:13.309)
I think there's never a particular period. I always love any install, any project that I'm doing finalizing. I love, you know, any sewer house that we installed. That's when the magic happens. Any private home right now that I'm with. I love it when clients get so excited when they come in our sample room and start picking materials. I love it when other people get excited and the joy and the magic when it becomes real, when things come out of the ground and they're real. That's so exciting.
When you see when you see when you been working off paper and then you see things come up any job sites i get to go to its friend and you like. It's gonna be amazing you start to see the magic of the creation is a work in a very physical world and so that's really fun.
Conscious Success Co (01:09:47.992)
Yeah.
Conscious Success Co (01:09:53.677)
Yeah. And getting to see that like you're, you know, through the creative process, getting to see it really take shape and become this thing that's like tactile that you can like touch and see and interact with it once existed only as a concept.
Vicky Charles (01:10:03.894)
Yeah.
and changes people's lives. Especially if you're renovating, it's like, it's so exciting that you're going to live in this new kitchen and it's all going to have everything you wanted. It's going to bring you joy. It's really fun. And it will live in it. And usually they get better and better. You know, when the smell of wet paint's gone and all your stuff's moving and then we've have clients who move in, they're like, it doesn't quite feel like ours. Well, you need to get your nonsense in the drawer or in the kitchen of all your string and band-aids and then you need your kids.
Conscious Success Co (01:10:31.576)
Yeah.
Vicky Charles (01:10:35.378)
paintings on the wall you know that's the fun the way it becomes yours that's the world you know them
Conscious Success Co (01:10:41.718)
Okay, I want to wrap up with a few rapid fire questions. What does conscious success mean to you?
Vicky Charles (01:10:44.733)
boy.
Vicky Charles (01:10:50.881)
choosing to be joyful.
Conscious Success Co (01:10:54.712)
So good. Even the people that we admire most are still growing and evolving. So what's one area of your life where you're currently being stretched or learning something new?
Vicky Charles (01:11:05.012)
I'm trying to take my health more seriously now. Being structured there. Like really putting it first, not just sitting at laptop all day working.
Conscious Success Co (01:11:12.14)
What does that look like to really put it first?
Vicky Charles (01:11:14.785)
Uh, making time in my calendar to move, like actually sleep more properly and exercise consistently every day. Cause it's so easy to just let that slip and just miss lunch. No. And as, as I, I just turned 50 this year, so I'm like, this is shit's got real sister. Let's locking in kid to make it like maintained, keep working for the next 20, 30 years, you know?
Conscious Success Co (01:11:26.818)
No one's gonna make that a priority for you.
Conscious Success Co (01:11:41.231)
Absolutely. I think it's something I always think about and talk to clients about. It's like you don't find the time, you make the time, and you just have to say, this is a priority and I am holding boundaries around it because it's never going to be that the to-do list is done. It's never going to be that people aren't asking for your time. You have to decide that comes first.
Vicky Charles (01:11:51.361)
100%.
Vicky Charles (01:11:59.777)
I have to, the biggest tip I was like, when you want to do something, you have to book it in your calendar. Like that's for me is like whether it's working on my book or whether it's something putting it in my calendar or those is just ends up on the list forever. Like the time.
Conscious Success Co (01:12:15.242)
Is there a Vicki Charles, Charles & Co. design book coming?
Vicky Charles (01:12:19.848)
One day, one day, starting to collect all those images. We've always photographed the work over the last 10 years, so yeah.
Conscious Success Co (01:12:28.152)
Well, I can't wait for that to make its way into the world. And I'm sure many of the people listening will want to get their hands on it. Who's someone in your world today who you admire for how they live, lead, or succeed? And what is it about them that inspires you?
Vicky Charles (01:12:32.179)
No.
Vicky Charles (01:12:44.019)
wow, that's a great question. My husband is pretty great at always growing. He's somebody who believes in growth and improving constantly in every aspect of his life.
which is, you know, I feel very lucky to be in a relationship that is about that change. Yeah, I would say Joe.
Conscious Success Co (01:13:09.39)
That's so nice to give that honor to your husband, to your partner. you could give your 10-year-old self one piece of advice, what would it be?
Vicky Charles (01:13:14.943)
You wouldn't expect it either.
Vicky Charles (01:13:26.113)
just it's gonna be okay. Just don't end up like, and it's, still give myself like, just it's gonna be okay. Don't worry. Like worry is such a useless emotion. Just lean in, there will be joy.
Conscious Success Co (01:13:40.098)
I love that. That's going to be echoing in my head now, where he has such a useless emotion. I think so many of us can keep that in mind because it doesn't do anything productive. It just drains you and burns you out.
Vicky Charles (01:13:45.281)
We're going to this.
Vicky Charles (01:13:52.065)
100 % write it down put it on the worry list and just leave it on there put it in the back of your pad and leave it on there.
Conscious Success Co (01:13:54.733)
Yeah
Conscious Success Co (01:13:58.231)
Yeah, it's like, is this worry actually productive? Is there an action here I need to take? And if not, let it go. Yeah.
Vicky Charles (01:14:03.521)
Exactly. Let it go. For sure. It's going to be okay. Enjoy more of it. Have more fun. Lean into more things. For sure.
Conscious Success Co (01:14:12.854)
If you could give the women listening who are trying to navigate their own ambition and also be present and great mothers and also honor themselves and passions, what would you tell them? What's the advice you would give these women?
Vicky Charles (01:14:29.218)
Just go, be kinder to yourselves. Just put, just, just, you're doing a great job. Just being there for your kids. Just be kinder to yourself. Really, like don't, just too many expectations. You look great. You're a great mom. You're working really hard. You're a great friend. Just, it's all right. That's enough today. Just, that's enough.
Conscious Success Co (01:14:53.11)
So it's so easy to be hyper-focused on where we feel we're falling short of the ideal versus seeing all the ways that we're meeting it.
Vicky Charles (01:15:01.345)
Yeah, like all the things you did today that was great, whether it's just hugging your kid before they went to school, you know, just gay, making sure you had something to eat with them for two minutes and just going for a walk, moving your body, I don't know, sending that one email. Great job. Just we're just too much pressure to do too much. For sure.
Conscious Success Co (01:15:20.622)
I I just love being in your orbit and hearing you speak because you just do have such a human first grounded, like worry free. And at the same time, you execute at a level of excellence and you build these really amazing relationships. I think sometimes it's easy to fall into the trap of thinking, well, if I'm not so hard on myself and I'm not so critical, then I'm going to be shit. I'm not going to do anything well. But that's actually you prove that that's not true and actually quite
the opposite of that. you're, you know, allow yourself to just be kind and see that even when things go wrong, there could actually be an opportunity in that and you can still keep moving forward by holding that mindset and do great work. And I think you demonstrate and prove that that is possible.
Vicky Charles (01:15:57.751)
for sure.
Vicky Charles (01:16:07.103)
I mean, I think also people relate to you more, like we're all human, you know, it's just, we're completely flawed. Our kids, we just, everyone's just doing their best, no matter how famous, rich, successful. It's just, it's much easier to relate to somebody without the expectation or barrier.
No.
Conscious Success Co (01:16:27.119)
Well, thank you so much for your time. I know how valuable it is and how scarce, so thank you for being here. I deeply appreciate it. All right. Let me… I'm all hip. Stop.
Vicky Charles (01:16:32.77)
anything for you, Emma. Anything for you. Always. Bye, Annie.
